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"Two Semesters": "Science" or Revelation?

by Cougs_Rule · 3/9/2011

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Cougs_Rule
Systematic formulation derived from years of experience?

One semester too little to reform? And shows favoritism to athletes?

Three Semesters too excessive for the penitent?



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snoscythe
Dude, you are really too worked up about this.



First, you start with the assumption that Brandon has been booted for two semesters. Last I heard, there was no final word on his return other than "not this year." There has been speculation in other threads that maybe that is what it will be, but there hasn't been a decision or announcement made.



Then, on the basis of that assumption, you are treating it as if it is a done-deal and trying to insinuate that inspiration didn't have a part in that decision (again, a decision that hasn't been made yet). You make this dig without a clue as to the specifics of BD's misdeeds, much less those of HU. Yet, because HU was kicked for two semesters and because there is some baseless speculation on internet boards that BD might get a similar punishment, you decide to go after the AD's office spiritual integrity on the strength of nothing more than supposition and rumor.



Fanhood is a choice. If you have such a hard time following a school that expects athletes to keep their commitments, maybe you should trade your blues in for some reds. They're pretty good at "second chances," and "third chances," and "fourth chances," and.......
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Mars
snoscythe wrote:
Fanhood is a choice... maybe you should trade your blues in for some reds. They're pretty good at "second chances," and "third chances," and "fourth chances," and.......

Yup. He just went there.
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Schmoe
Mars wrote:
Fanhood is a choice... maybe you should trade your blues in for some reds. They're pretty good at "second chances," and "third chances," and "fourth chances," and.......

Yup. He just went there.



:lol:
C
Cougs_Rule
Some of us dont have to smear our blue-dom all over ourselves to prove we are blue.

Some of us dont have to blindly accept all that seems to be, but isnt necessarily so, to prove our fanhood.

Some reduce the dialogue to the spouting of simple platitudes and/or challenge one's very "fanhood" by suggesting our lack of total obescience represents a move to the enemy; all this in the absence of more compelling comebacks or ansers to the question at hand.

Some of us choose to express our "fanhood" in ways that others with a view from their supposed "highroad" look down upon with scorn and contempt.

I can take it from Sno. He's a worthy critic. And I have been, to some or maybe most, annoyingly vocal about these matters.
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Guest
Some can complain about things that haven't happened yet, and may not happen at all.
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BoiseBYU
hawkwing wrote:
Some can complain about things that haven't happened yet, and may not happen at all.

I've got a problem with that! :) Actually, DM my friend, take a deep breath, check out a sunset or two and go buy a lemonade (or even a diet coke ;) )from the local neighborhood kids or have a snowball fight with the kiddies...Things won't look so bad after that
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bigbluepuma
:bug:
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Cougs_Rule
hawkwing wrote:
Some can complain about things that haven't happened yet, and may not happen at all.


Is that your answer to my question or are you just excited about me starting a thread that you actually like? ;-)
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Mars
hawkwing wrote:
Some can complain about things that haven't happened yet, and may not happen at all.

My favorite is the end of the world in 2012. Once again, the Aztecs suck!
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Gunk
DMCougar, you and everyone else certainly know where I fall in regards to this whole thing, but I am waiting until the final verdict before criticizing it.



My guess is coming into good graces with BYU may coincide a bit with his repentance process. Depending on what steps his Bishop has outlined for him BYU may mirror the same from a timing perspective. I don't necessarily agree with that as I lean more towards a separation of church and state.



There's basically one month left in the semester, so my guess is he'll finish out the semester and if there is an official dismiss from BYU it will begin in the Spring. If I recall correctly from the Unga situation, there were cutoffs and deadlines on when he could apply for reinstatement, etc. and he didn't qualify soon enough for the first one so would have to wait until the next time around, which was in Jan. Too late for football.



Prepare for the worst, we may not see BD in uniform until Nov. 2012. He'll probably get reinstated with the school before then, but because of NCAA deadlines and BYU deadlines he won't make it in time for next season.
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Cougs_Rule
Gunk, thanks for your measured and rational response. its clear you have also thought out the possibilities. And while waiting is reasonable, I have continued my drawn out rants about the downsides to this process.

For my opinion on this record, yes Brandon screwed up and deserves suspension and disciplinary matters. And I do appreciate BYU for sticking true to it s core values and the gospel.

BUt given your description above and what I fear, is that this whole process is a mutually reinforcing worse timing case scenario for BD. Its so public now, that even if BYU had any wiggle room, they will dispense the fullest measure of discipline (*and of course hugs) that they now must. His Bishop is in the spotlight of the Church (at least to all those around him in his ward and stake, as is the Stk Pres. So everybody is in the spotlight and we all want to believe justice and mercy is being weighed out, but now that BYU has been touted they dont want to be labeled as hypocrites by levying less than whatever byu defines as ample discipline--------thus my questioning.
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radius19
dmcougar wrote:
Gunk, thanks for your measured and rational response. its clear you have also thought out the possibilities. And while waiting is reasonable, I have continued my drawn out rants about the downsides to this process.

For my opinion on this record, yes Brandon screwed up and deserves suspension and disciplinary matters. And I do appreciate BYU for sticking true to it s core values and the gospel.

BUt given your description above and what I fear, is that this whole process is a mutually reinforcing worse timing case scenario for BD. Its so public now, that even if BYU had any wiggle room, they will dispense the fullest measure of discipline (*and of course hugs) that they now must. His Bishop is in the spotlight of the Church (at least to all those around him in his ward and stake, as is the Stk Pres. So everybody is in the spotlight and we all want to believe justice and mercy is being weighed out, but now that BYU has been touted they dont want to be labeled as hypocrites by levying less than whatever byu defines as ample discipline--------thus my questioning.


Who's to say that they don't do the opposite? Maybe they limit the punishment because the 'light' has already shown so brightly on BYU because of the timing (i.e. costing this time a likely Elite 8/ Final 4 run) and BYU has already made their stand on the situation. I don't know what is going to happen anymore than you do but to instantly assume the worst of all involved is not a great reaction. Hold your horses, we'll all find out in the coming months what is going down.
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Brayden Green
BoiseBYU wrote:
Some can complain about things that haven't happened yet, and may not happen at all.

I've got a problem with that! :) Actually, DM my friend, take a deep breath, check out a sunset or two and go buy a lemonade (or even a diet coke ;) )from the local neighborhood kids or have a snowball fight with the kiddies...Things won't look so bad after that


Does she have a license to sell that lemonade?



http://www.oregonlive.com/portland/index.ssf/2010/08/portland_lemonade_stand_runs_i.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
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Brayden Green
If the HU situation should teach us anything, it is that BYU neither "makes examples" out of people, nor does it "bend the rules" to allow them to participate early. Repentance takes as long as it takes. For some people it is a day, week, month, or year.



It has a lot to do with your own conscience, and how fast you can pick yourself back up and get back on the horse. There is very rarely a regimented way to do things. It depends on the person. In BD's case, there may need to be a reform of character (or may not) and that is a harder thing to do. Not only committing the sin, but creating a position in your life for the sin, and acquiring a "taste" for the behavior. That takes a little longer, because one needs to alter his character and in essence get to the roots of why he needed that, in order to fill up that void and not have an "empty house" for those desires to return to.
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Cougs_Rule
BlueIsBetter wrote:
If the HU situation should teach us anything, it is that BYU neither "makes examples" out of people, nor does it "bend the rules" to allow them to participate early. Repentance takes as long as it takes. For some people it is a day, week, month, or year.



It has a lot to do with your own conscience, and how fast you can pick yourself back up and get back on the horse. There is very rarely a regimented way to do things. It depends on the person. In BD's case, there may need to be a reform of character (or may not) and that is a harder thing to do. Not only committing the sin, but creating a position in your life for the sin, and acquiring a "taste" for the behavior. That takes a little longer, because one needs to alter his character and in essence get to the roots of why he needed that, in order to fill up that void and not have an "empty house" for those desires to return to.


Or consider castration or marriage.
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loonmj
dmcougar wrote:



Or consider castration or marriage.


Now you're being redundant. ;)
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Cougs_Rule
Apparently not for these two bunnies.
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Gunk
dmcougar wrote:
Gunk, thanks for your measured and rational response. its clear you have also thought out the possibilities. And while waiting is reasonable, I have continued my drawn out rants about the downsides to this process.

For my opinion on this record, yes Brandon screwed up and deserves suspension and disciplinary matters. And I do appreciate BYU for sticking true to it s core values and the gospel.

BUt given your description above and what I fear, is that this whole process is a mutually reinforcing worse timing case scenario for BD. Its so public now, that even if BYU had any wiggle room, they will dispense the fullest measure of discipline (*and of course hugs) that they now must. His Bishop is in the spotlight of the Church (at least to all those around him in his ward and stake, as is the Stk Pres. So everybody is in the spotlight and we all want to believe justice and mercy is being weighed out, but now that BYU has been touted they dont want to be labeled as hypocrites by levying less than whatever byu defines as ample discipline--------thus my questioning.


This is where I hope and believe a bit of separation from church and state can occur. It's between BD and his Bishop when BD is temple worthy again and exactly what measures of discipline were set in place (my guess, a dis-fellowship) as far as his repentance process goes.



Being temple worthy and being worthy to attend BYU should be two separate items. BD will obviously need an ecclesiastical endorsement to attend BYU, but I think BD should be able to meet those demands before he meets the demands to be temple worthy. There are plenty of students at BYU that are not worthy to attend the temple or excersise their priesthood (tithing, WoW, chastity, porn, etc.) but are still able to attend BYU.
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Brayden Green
Gunk wrote:
Gunk, thanks for your measured and rational response. its clear you have also thought out the possibilities. And while waiting is reasonable, I have continued my drawn out rants about the downsides to this process.

For my opinion on this record, yes Brandon screwed up and deserves suspension and disciplinary matters. And I do appreciate BYU for sticking true to it s core values and the gospel.

BUt given your description above and what I fear, is that this whole process is a mutually reinforcing worse timing case scenario for BD. Its so public now, that even if BYU had any wiggle room, they will dispense the fullest measure of discipline (*and of course hugs) that they now must. His Bishop is in the spotlight of the Church (at least to all those around him in his ward and stake, as is the Stk Pres. So everybody is in the spotlight and we all want to believe justice and mercy is being weighed out, but now that BYU has been touted they dont want to be labeled as hypocrites by levying less than whatever byu defines as ample discipline--------thus my questioning.


This is where I hope and believe a bit of separation from church and state can occur. It's between BD and his Bishop when BD is temple worthy again and exactly what measures of discipline were set in place (my guess, a dis-fellowship) as far as his repentance process goes.



Being temple worthy and being worthy to attend BYU should be two separate items. BD will obviously need an ecclesiastical endorsement to attend BYU, but I think BD should be able to meet those demands before he meets the demands to be temple worthy. There are plenty of students at BYU that are not worthy to attend the temple or excersise their priesthood (tithing, WoW, chastity, porn, etc.) but are still able to attend BYU.


Plus, Davies isn't even endowed yet, so there is a lot less "light" to sin against. I would be very surprised if he gets anything semi-serious church discipline wise. I wouldn't even expect him in front of a disciplinary council either (depending on exact details, etc.)



It is all up to his preisthood leaders, but it very important that he hasn't had temple blessings, and covenants yet.
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