HC Office Double Standard--the pendulum effect

You know, this really makes me think that what we are facing in this current day and age is a total pendulum shift from the 80's.

In the 80's it was all about the double standard in favor of the athletes.

In the 2010's it all about a reverse double standard against athletes.

I agree to the Code. I question the administration of that code.

And I will go on record as saying that this near Shakesperean tragedy (if the BYU doesnt pull out of this free-fall) will alter the way the HC office handles situations like this.

I don't think so - though there is something that really stinks about this. The folks @ the HC Office will wrap themselves in the rules & righteous indignation. Their predictable fall-back is: "But it's the rules, the standards - there is NOTHING we could do. We were compelled & bound." Right.

My biggest beef is that the kid got booted off the team prior to the investigation being completed. Basically, it is guilty until proven otherwise, instead of not guilty until all the facts are compiled to make the case.



Listen, I understand that the kid most likely did it. I understand what the HC is about and support most of it (some is silliness). But process must be respected, and here it appears it was not. He was booted, and then the investigation continued. And still continues today. Something wrong about that.

If the rumors are true on how it went down, what bothers me is some 3rd party gets involved and the HC office does a knee-jerk reaction to a 3rd party source. That's hearsay, if my legal terms are correct and rather than check things out, make an informed decision, the HC office reacted to unsubstantiated information. What's to stop any student going in and making claims against any other student, athlete or not?



And, as dmcougar points out, the athletes bare more than their fair share. Davies is kicked off the team, his dirty laundry left to air in front of millions; meanwhile, the ecclesiastic status of Davies' partner in crime remains intact and her identity preserved.



Yes, she'll have to deal with pregnancy and having a kid and that will "disrupt" her life, but it takes two to tango and the "consequences" of their dance as far as the HC Office is concerned definitely seem to be falling more on Davies.

Gunk wrote:
If the rumors are true on how it went down, what bothers me is some 3rd party gets involved and the HC office does a knee-jerk reaction to a 3rd party source. That's hearsay, if my legal terms are correct and rather than check things out, make an informed decision, the HC office reacted to unsubstantiated information. What's to stop any student going in and making claims against any other student, athlete or not?



They aren't true.



And, as dmcougar points out, the athletes bare more than their fair share. Davies is kicked off the team, his dirty laundry left to air in front of millions; meanwhile, the ecclesiastic status of Davies' partner in crime remains intact and her identity preserved.



Has it occurred to anyone that maybe Davies has more honor than most and is trying to protect her.



Yes, she'll have to deal with pregnancy and having a kid and that will "disrupt" her life, but it takes two to tango and the "consequences" of their dance as far as the HC Office is concerned definitely seem to be falling more on Davies.

There is no pregnancy.

saywhat wrote:

If the rumors are true on how it went down, what bothers me is some 3rd party gets involved and the HC office does a knee-jerk reaction to a 3rd party source. That's hearsay, if my legal terms are correct and rather than check things out, make an informed decision, the HC office reacted to unsubstantiated information. What's to stop any student going in and making claims against any other student, athlete or not?



They aren't true.



And, as dmcougar points out, the athletes bare more than their fair share. Davies is kicked off the team, his dirty laundry left to air in front of millions; meanwhile, the ecclesiastic status of Davies' partner in crime remains intact and her identity preserved.



Has it occurred to anyone that maybe Davies has more honor than most and is trying to protect her.



Yes, she'll have to deal with pregnancy and having a kid and that will "disrupt" her life, but it takes two to tango and the "consequences" of their dance as far as the HC Office is concerned definitely seem to be falling more on Davies.

There is no pregnancy.

Source? Because there are plenty of other "sources" saying there is one.

Those sources are wrong.

From what I garner, Davies "confessed" so that kind of speeds up the investigation. I assume that is why it went down so quickly. I just hope they show him lattitude not because he is an athlete but because he is only 19, not endowed, non RM, growing young man. I have seen it go both ways on these cases and I hope it goes on the more lenient side so he can overcome his issue and prove that he is ready to get back on the right path instead of sit at home, work at Bking, and try and prove it while attending UVSU. Also, I wholeheartily believe that the student wards are some of the best support groups for men 18-25. I know I loved every ward I ever attended and enjoyed the spirit of all the meetings.

I think the latitude option is gone!

Davies didn't confess.



He just didn't deny allegations.

Do you KNOW that?

saywhat wrote:
Do you KNOW that?

If you know what really happened let us know, and let us decide if we believe it or not.

I know enough to know that isn't true.

Lawboy wrote:
My biggest beef is that the kid got booted off the team prior to the investigation being completed. Basically, it is guilty until proven otherwise, instead of not guilty until all the facts are compiled to make the case.



Listen, I understand that the kid most likely did it. I understand what the HC is about and support most of it (some is silliness). But process must be respected, and here it appears it was not. He was booted, and then the investigation continued. And still continues today. Something wrong about that.

Gunk wrote:
If the rumors are true on how it went down, what bothers me is some 3rd party gets involved and the HC office does a knee-jerk reaction to a 3rd party source. That's hearsay, if my legal terms are correct and rather than check things out, make an informed decision, the HC office reacted to unsubstantiated information. What's to stop any student going in and making claims against any other student, athlete or not?

BlueIsBetter wrote:
Davies didn't confess.



He just didn't deny allegations.

Many assumptions and conclusions are happening. Like Imua said and ESPN has confirmed, Davies has admitted to breaking HC...some are assuming that only happened after he was let go from the team. Everything I have seen leads me to believe that Davies said he violated HC and then I am assuming (everyone else is assuming so why cant I?) That is why he was let go from the team. Now as far as was Davies found out by a 3rd party then reported to HC that is a possibility but it does not mean the HC immediately kicked him off the team. It is as simple as the HC learned of it (whoever brought it to their attention), they approached and asked Davies and he admitted to the violation. So to the person asking what keeps another student from going and reporting someone randomly and the HC bringing down the hammer? Nothing. However, HC can't bring down the hammer if the person accused denies the accusation. They will be under investigation but no action will be taken at that time. So that begs to question, and may be the hang up for some, why is their still and "investigation" if he has already admitted or confessed? The investigation could simply be investigating if the violation is bad enough that he should also be kicked out of school or if not as severe then let him stay enrolled and working on his education. They could be seeking for information such as, is Davies working with his ecclesiastical leader, how long ago did the violation happen, is it a repeat violation that has been reported on Davies before? If he has already admitted they may just be finding out all information to determine the length of probation or if he can still be enrolled. They are NOT investigating did he break the Honor Code. With him admitting they can already kick him off the team, but they want to see if he is already working on restitution before deciding to take away his enrollment or maybe they will find that he can stay enrolled but on a probationary state.

Even though this discussion is getting off topic a little, I think its HUGE if she is or is not Pregnant! Not in the moral domain or right or wrong, but in the administering of consequences. In other words, if she's not pregnant, its not as "public" and immediate and even almost frenetic decision making by the HC office was unnecessary.

If I handled all sensitive personnel decisions as decisive and almost reactive, I would have several govt entities pouring into my shop.

This thread was more about how "non-reactive and almost "cover-up" that the HC office was in the 80's and how the student body screamed bloody murder for favoritism toward athletes. Now the other shoe has dropped and I believe the HC office has become hyper reactive to athletes.



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have you read the article, imua and kiwi? It says nothing about Davies "breaking the news/confessing" to anyone.



We simply don't know and can't assume.

And I'm going to ignore "saywhat"



Somebody let me know if he has anything other than half-hidden hints as to what really did and didn't happen.

BlueIsBetter wrote:
have you read the article, imua and kiwi? It says nothing about Davies "breaking the news/confessing" to anyone.



We simply don't know and can't assume.

He spoke with Rose about it and with Holmoe. Rose has said Brandon brought it to Rose. Also the ESPN article keeps getting "updated" so what it used to say is different than what it now says.

BlueIsBetter wrote:
And I'm going to ignore "saywhat"



Somebody let me know if he has anything other than half-hidden hints as to what really did and didn't happen.

You can ignore what I say all you want...doesn't make it not true. You've been plenty willing to listen to everybody else's made up stories. I have said yes or no to dispel things that I know about. Doesn't make it not true. I not going to tell accounts of events that are not mine to tell. If people keep saying " blah, blah, blah, she is pregnant" and I know it's ABSOLUTELY NOT TRUE, I'm going to say it.



Brandon is an incredible young man. It's horrible the humiliation that he has had to endure and the stories that are being made up just so people can feel better about something. But I can tell you the truth is not never as sensational as the stories.

saywhat wrote:

And I'm going to ignore "saywhat"



Somebody let me know if he has anything other than half-hidden hints as to what really did and didn't happen.

You can ignore what I say all you want...doesn't make it not true. You've been plenty willing to listen to everybody else's made up stories. I have said yes or no to dispel things that I know about. Doesn't make it not true. I not going to tell accounts of events that are not mine to tell. If people keep saying " blah, blah, blah, she is pregnant" and I know it's ABSOLUTELY NOT TRUE, I'm going to say it.



Brandon is an incredible young man. It's horrible the humiliation that he has had to endure and the stories that are being made up just so people can feel better about something. But I can tell you the truth is not never as sensational as the stories.

I agree with all you are saying here.



All of your other posts are

"Do you know this?"

Do you know that?

Would you eat that on a plane?

Would you eat it in a pie?

Would you eat it in the sky?

Would you eat it on the ground?

Would you eat it upside down?

I mean, if you know something, just say it. If you know that something isn't what it is. Then say that...



A simple, I know that isn't true because I actually work for the HC office. Or because I am on the team. Or because I am "so and so."



and I have confirmed my claims of who I am with the board moderators...



That's all. ;)