Archived Topic

Down Hill

by mcgregor · 10/3/2010

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mcgregor
As many have probably noted already, Hill wasn't fired for anything on the field.



If this was simply about coaching skill upgrade, Hill would have been one of the last to go. But that's not what this was about. And this was pretty much the only decision that could have been made.
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Ddawg
mcgregor wrote:



Hill wasn't fired for anything on the field.



If this was simply about coaching skill upgrade, Hill would have been one of the last to go. But that's not what this was about.



And this was pretty much the only decision that could have been made.


Ok McGregor - you got my attention!!! Obviously you have some inside scoop!!! I am in the dark here - what's the story??? What really happened & why was Jamie Hill fired???? Was it friction between Hill & ther players? Friction between Hill & Bronco?? A combo of both?? Love to hear what is going on.



Thx!!
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mcgregor
Ddawg wrote:



Hill wasn't fired for anything on the field.



If this was simply about coaching skill upgrade, Hill would have been one of the last to go. But that's not what this was about.



And this was pretty much the only decision that could have been made.


Ok McGregor - you got my attention!!! Obviously you have some inside scoop!!! I am in the dark here - what's the story??? What really happened & why was Jamie Hill fired???? Was it friction between Hill & ther players? Friction between Hill & Bronco?? A combo of both?? Love to hear what is going on.



Thx!!


I don't really have any inside information that hasn't been shared in some form or another elsewhere.



In general, while a master technician and teacher, he wasn't the most humble, sensitive, or socially competent person. He had personality conflicts with players and coaches, many of which have been made public.
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Cougarbib
This thread is much more credible than the Hill is gone thread. I won't repeat my long post here. I gave several theories more in line with previus context than the theme of that thread. This is in line with context and the kind of things that could lead to a mid-season firing of a recently promoted black coach.



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Schmoe
"...firing of a recently promoted black coach."



Really? You don't think this would have happened with a white coach who had the same personality clashes with players and coaches?
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Ddawg
Schmoe wrote:
"...firing of a recently promoted black coach."



Really? You don't think this would have happened with a white coach who had the same personality clashes with players and coaches?


Yes of course it would have. If there were internal conclicts between Coach Hill & both the players & Coaching Staff - it can grow to the point where it interferes w/ the central mission - winning football games.



If there was this internal conflict (it's obvious there was a problem) - certainly it didn't matter whether Coach Hill was black, pacific islander, white, eskimo, or a gypsy from Transylvania. If it became detrimental to the teams success - it needed to be addressed. I'm certain Bronco had discussions w/ Jamie over the past several weeks leading up to this. I'm certain - whatever it was - it could not be resolved. Bronco addressed it directly & will press forward. Jamie Hill will move on to other opportunities.



I'm also certain Coach Hill will have no problem moving forward & landing another job in College football if he desires that. I also feel Bronco will assist Coach Hill find employment by making inquiries & recomendations if that help is desired. Perhaps he'd like to try jumping to the NFL?? Who knows??
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Cougarbib
Read my post in the other thread. As I explained, it would take something like this to pull of firing a black coach recently promoted, suddenly. The theory in that other thread that Bronco wanted to fire Anae and Hill for on the field reasons but chose to fire Hill now and Anae later because Hill can be filled in for by Bronco is not consistent with previous context and would have great legal risk.



Re your question about whether team conflict by a white coach being able to justify the white coach getting fired - obviously yes. It is really easy to fire white guys unless they are old, war vets, disabled, or a whistleblower. Firing coaches, generally is probably easier to justify than firing other professionals, but anything that could be construed as discrimination against a PROTECTED CLASS of employee under the law is high risk for losing a law suit. Protected classes include - blacks, Hispanics, old people, women, war veterans, etc. Perceived discrimination based on sexual orientation or religious beliefs can also be a problem.



But, the easiest person in the world to fire - Make that in the USA - is a young white male.



If there was disharmony in the team caused by Hill who was also not delivering expected performance on the field, especially if expectations were clear and documented and verbal and written warnings have been given, allows you to fire anyone.



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Schmoe
Ok, that makes sense, I get what you're saying now (hence the reason I asked the question).
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byutx
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BoiseBYU
byutx wrote:
Word is that Hill gave up in Logan. He wouldn't call plays. Wouldn't talk to the staff or players. Basically went emotionally and mentaly AWOL. If true, that would have been the precipitating cause with underlying aggravating factors including his social problems, the fact that his players mostly hate him, many of the coaches don't like him. Another major factor is that the secondary should've been a major strength and our defense should have been much, much better. But, here's some stats tweeted by GWrubell: BYU now dead last (120th) in rushing defense (259.2 yards per game). 101st in total defense, 87th scoring defense, 85th pass eff defense.


Wow. So when Hill goew AWOL in the second half the D rises up and stops USU?



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byutx
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BoiseBYU
byutx wrote:
byutx wrote:
Word is that Hill gave up in Logan. He wouldn't call plays. Wouldn't talk to the staff or players. Basically went emotionally and mentaly AWOL. If true, that would have been the precipitating cause with underlying aggravating factors including his social problems, the fact that his players mostly hate him, many of the coaches don't like him. Another major factor is that the secondary should've been a major strength and our defense should have been much, much better. But, here's some stats tweeted by GWrubell: BYU now dead last (120th) in rushing defense (259.2 yards per game). 101st in total defense, 87th scoring defense, 85th pass eff defense.


Wow. So when Hill goew AWOL in the second half the D rises up and stops USU?



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Maybe Bronco took over?


Maybe?



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byutx
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BoiseBYU
byutx wrote:
byutx wrote:
byutx wrote:
Word is that Hill gave up in Logan. He wouldn't call plays. Wouldn't talk to the staff or players. Basically went emotionally and mentaly AWOL. If true, that would have been the precipitating cause with underlying aggravating factors including his social problems, the fact that his players mostly hate him, many of the coaches don't like him. Another major factor is that the secondary should've been a major strength and our defense should have been much, much better. But, here's some stats tweeted by GWrubell: BYU now dead last (120th) in rushing defense (259.2 yards per game). 101st in total defense, 87th scoring defense, 85th pass eff defense.


Wow. So when Hill goew AWOL in the second half the D rises up and stops USU?



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Maybe Bronco took over?


Maybe?

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My info is good (meaning "accurate") but certainly lacking in details.


Thanks. I was being sarcastic



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BigCougsFan
You think Hill gave up, in Logan??? If that's true... I hope the door did hit his butt on the way out!



There is no place for Hill at BYU. I don't want him anywhere near BYU if that's the case.



Dick Harmon made it sound like he had another job lined up with another team. If this is the case, that's cool BUT don't give up on your team. I think I "hate" him as much as his players he coached.
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kiwibacon
Makes me wonder about the egg incident...It has always been speculated to have been over zealous fans. What are the chances it was some less than happy players?
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Cougarbib
Not bacon and eggs - right



TIC



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kiwibacon
Cougarbib2 wrote:
Not bacon and eggs - right



TIC



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Bacon does not live in Utah. No bacon involved in that one. Yes, I did see your TIC. :D
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Ddawg
kiwibacon wrote:
Makes me wonder about the egg incident...It has always been speculated to have been over zealous fans. What are the chances it was some less than happy players?


Oooooooooooooh! Hmmmmm ....... That's an interesting perspective! I always "assumed" it was some looney, over zealous fans. The theory that it might have been 1 or more discouraged, disgruntled football team members has a "ring" of truth to it. Considering the recent developments (the release of Coach Hill) & the info. about the Utah St. game (that Coach Hill bcame so upset/discouraged he gave up/mentally withdrew from doing his job). Keep adding up the numbers & you will get something - a Coach that created discouraged/disaffected team members & buckled under pressure when he needed to be effective & strong. Perhaps there is something to the theory.



Interesting!!!!!!
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BigCougsFan
Did someone egg his car or something?



I don't recall that.



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