Talent vs. Preparedness

No one has come right out and said it, but I've heard a lot of comments hinting that we are just not as talented as the teams we are getting beat by, and I'm sorry I just don't buy that.



I really fail to believe that we are getting beat on a yearly basis in recruiting by Nevada-Reno and Air Force. I can almost buy into the FSU thing about better recruits, except that FSU is simply not very good. They weren't last year, and they won't be this year. They got crushed by a pretty bad OU team, that only barely beat USU and AF.



We have the personnel to beat these middle of the road teams, and even if they are good, shouldn't we be better? I think our players aren't being prepared well enough, and we aren't putting them in the right positions to succeed, especially on defense.



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Like I mentioned in another thread—I think it is time for longer... much longer practices. Run it until everyone does it right. We have plenty of talent, just no execution. And if a player doesn't do it right then replace him with all the talent that is sitting around.

tww wrote:
Like I mentioned in another thread—I think it is time for longer... much longer practices. Run it until everyone does it right. We have plenty of talent, just no execution. And if a player doesn't do it right then replace him with all the talent that is sitting around.

Talent, execution... what about speed? Our defense just doesn't have it. When you have no speed you have no choice BUT to execute 100% perfectly, and how often does that happen?

what kind of speed are you looking for? Who is lacking in speed against Nevada or Air Force?

I think when things are down, it is just way too easy to sit around and point the finger at things we perceive to be off. And I think that is flat out wrong in this case. this program has been built from the ground up. PLayers know what to do, what is expected of them, using methods that have worked for 4 years straight. When the players are good enough to make the plays, it gets done. When they are not, they don't. The fast is, the players are just not good enough RIGHT NOW. Heaps is not making the right throws at the right time. He really looks like a true freshman because he is one. He has not mastered the "move the chains" offense, nor did he look good in the red zone. We can sit here all day and blame some things on bad play calling, which did happen. However, if the coaches had faith in a set playbook and execution, they would not have to take chances with suspect plays. I think the coaches have a solid grasp on this team--and its weaknesses. We say yesterday why Riley and jake were splitting reps. And it had zero to do with talent, and everything to do with the talent not being refined enough yet.



People need to be patient. this is a true rebuild year, much like Bronco's first year was a rebuild year. I think every program has to rebuild, and once every 5 years is fine with me. We are seeing the foundation for 2011 and beyond put in t place now, and while it is painful now, it will pay off later. Consider this our Utah 2005 season. Be patient.

Talent, excecution, experience, preparedness, effort, drive, determination, focus, team chemistry, coaching, cheerleading, crowd, referees, pickle juice, luck etc. I think you've attempted to oversimplify the issue. We have plenty of talent. Are they playing as a group well enough to beat the few talented and experienced teams that we have played so far? No way.



The problem is that teams have seen enough about BYU to exploit our weaknesses. FSU continually got big plays by sweeping to the left. Air Force quickly discovered that BYU had no answer (yet) to the option and that our inexperienced defense was going to be out of position and guessing.



I agree that BYU might be more talented, but they have a TON of other variables that I don't know about. At the same time, I'm not worried. Bronco will still get results out of this season.

I agree with that declou, I was just answering the growing "face it, we're just not that talented" crow that seems to be rising. We are plenty talented to beat teams like Air Force, Nevada, USU (when we lose to them) and the handful of other teams we may or may not lose to this year.



I mean, you want to talk about limited recruiting bases, how about Air Force, Army and Navy? The only way you can play ball for us is signing up for the services. That is like the honor code, and then some. We should be able to beat Air Force on a yearly basis, no contest. No throwing game at all, and we still can't beat them? That has to come down to coaching and preparedness when our worst guy out there on D is a better recruit than most their best guys on O.

And the same goes for Nevada... Have they had a top 50 recruiting class once in the last 5 years? I don't think we've missed the top 50 in the last 5 years. Maybe 06, but not since Bronco has shown success.

I love the recruiting argument. Since we recruit better than Nevada, we should always beat them. By the same logic, we should never beat Alabama, Texas, Notre Dame, right? Seriously, do not go there.



The 2010 team IS NOT talented enough. It is obvious. go watch games 1-4. We lack playmakers on both sides of the ball.

Put lesser talent into a program for 4-5 years and then match them up against "better" talent just coming out of high school or with a years experience and your lesser talented guys have surprisingly gained ground or are better than the newer guys. It's not difficult to imagine that a few years training and developing in college will put you so much further ahead of the better high school guys. Would any of you have picked Kapernick over heaps coming out of HS? Yesterday would anyone have chosen heaps as their starter over a more seasoned Kapernick? Talent matters, but it still has to be developed.



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Matt reynolds, Jake Heaps, JJ DiLuigi, Josh Quezada, McKay Jacobsen, Cody Hoffman all would argue against you on the offensive side of the ball.



On the defensive side we are less talented, but we have Rich, Pendleton, Eason, Bradley, Logan, Fuga, So' oto, Manumaleuana, Van noy. They are all more talented than their defensive counterparts of Nevada, washington, Air force, and probably even FSU. They are out of place, and not being used as they should.



Recruiting doesn't have everything to do with winning and losing, so you prove my point there. If we have better talent than the other team, either our players aren't" executing" or they are in the wrong place to be executing.



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We have more talent and speed then we have ever had, yet we have not adjusted our schemes to put our increased talent to use.



I thought we had made a change during last years bowl game by playing significantly more man defense and bringing a little more pressure. But, even though we have most of our secondary back, we don't do that at all. It might even be less than last year.



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One or two of you are either as thick as 10 bricks or a TROLL.



Experience matters. Proven talent almost always beat unproven talent.



Proven talent = Hall, Pitta, Unga, George, Tonga last year as skill players on offense. They were proven because they played well the previous year and they are talented enough to get at least an NFZl look.



Heaps may or may not eventually be as good as Hall, but he isn't yet and won't be for a while. JJ is not proven coming into 2010 but is one player starting to prove his talent. NFL quality still TBD, but proving to be a playmaker. Still not Harvey Unga. All of our tight ends are unproven and may or may not be as good as Pitta and George later but they are not now. No proven equivalent of Tonga yet. Jacobsen and Chambers may or may not break out like JJ is, but they are only partially proven value and still nit clearly NFL talent.



Similar situation on D. Meanwhile we play best AFA team in over a decade, best Nevada team in - maybe forever, and a 3-1 FSU team that was fast and physical - 2 if them on the road.



Give it a rest. We lack PROVEN, EXPERIENCED, NFL CALIBER TALENT at too many positions to assume we should beat teams we would have beaten the past 4 years.



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Ps - Juice, VanNoy, APO, etc are potentially great talents that have almost no experience and a lot to prove. Given time - some of them will prove to be NFL caliber



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JJ's numbers are much better than any of Harvey's... Not much of what you say is intelligble there.

This thread would be more appropriately titled "experience vs talent" BYU's physical talent is better then it has been since Bronco took over in 2005. The teams we have lost to so far have all has sr qb's that have been running the offense for years. The reason BYU is losing is because we have a team loaded with redshirt/true freshman that have never taken a snap on a college team. It is going to take time but this team is going to be good. Unfortunately, the fans don't want to see us losing to Nevada in the process.

Cougarbib2 wrote:
Ps - Juice, VanNoy, APO, etc are potentially great talents that have almost no experience and a lot to prove. Given time - some of them will prove to be NFL caliber



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I don't know any of the LB's numbers so it's hard to tell if he's getting time. I have seen Stout get playing time, but then again, with the way our D is playing I don't even believe we have 11 guys on the field.



Honestly, Juice should get more touches than he does. He has a better skill set than JJ and looks like he has the ability to break away--something we haven't had since Staley. JJ has been our only offensive weapon so far so it's easy to just say that he should not lose reps, but taking everything into perspective I think Juice is faster and has much more upside. Give him the rock...at least in place of Kariya for heaven's sake!