Archived Topic

Don't forget we're still several weeks behind

by byutx · 9/26/2010

byutx

9/26/2010, 3:11:42 PM

In terms of offensive production, unit and team cohesion and experience, etc., we are several weeks behind where we should be thanks to indecision and lack of leadership from the coaching staff. I have been saying for two weeks now that we're in the equivalent of fall camp. I assumed that each week we would progress like we might expect a team to progress in fall camp. After 3 more weeks, I figured, we'd be ready for our first couple games, which would help us iron out some kinks.

However, much like with the dreams in Inception, there is much more "time" in a fall camp week than in a regular season week. In fact, I think each fall week may be the equivalent of at least 4 game weeks in every area except, obviously, actual game experience against opponents. That experience means a lot, but even if you knock the ratio down to 3 game weeks:1 camp week, we're still quite a bit behind. The things we just simply can't do during game weeks that we need: master the basics, spend all day (2 practice sessions, team meetings and NO CLASSES) on football, etc. I do think we got a lot of beneficial work done in fall camp, so we're only short a couple weeks.

I used to think that the SDSU game would be the equivalent to our first game of the season. But, if the 3:1 ratio is accurate (I'm not sure if it is and I hope I'm wrong), we're not going to be "ready" for our first game until our 8th game-Oct. 23 vs. Wyoming. I think we'll go into that game with a 3-4 record (wins @USU, vs. SDSU and loss @ TCU) and we'll need to win 3 of 4 before the Utah game to be bowl eligible, which I think we can. I think by the 4th game of the season, you should have smoothed enough edges to have a good idea of who your team is and what it can do. That "4th" game of the season is a tune-up home game against UNM. That might be enough time and experience to get us ready to compete with Utah and then with our bowl opponent, which will hopefully be in (Ft. Worth Armed Forces Bowl) or around (Shreveport, LA Independence Bowl) my neck of the woods.

In sum, this has become somewhat of a throwaway season due in most part to this staff's worst decision to date and one of the worst ever in our football program. I think it can be salvaged over time and I hope we can end on a relative high note.

Go Cougars!

Cougarfan87

9/26/2010, 3:29:23 PM

I agree completely. This season is a great chance to get our young guys experience and tear up our first season as an independent. In that vein, we need to run Juice more. He looked awesome on those running plays. Also, the QB indecision really hurt us. I know most people on this board can't stand Florida, but for a primer on how to use "situational QB's" look no further than Leak/Tebow and now Brantley/Burton. The passing QB moves the team into the redzone (Heaps) and then the Situational QB (Nelson) punches it in. I think Heaps moves the ball down the field well, and I think Nelson was a good scoring QB. It is too bad we couldn't use them the right way. Oh, weel, water under the bridge. Now Heaps needs to use the rest of the seaon to get in sinc with his receivers.

I saw some good things in this game (which is a lot more enjoyable if you put it on mute and substitute your own commentary rather than listen to the Nevada love fest or whoever will be playing BYU this year on the MTN).

The Good:

1. Hoffman made some great grabs.

2. We passed to a Tight End over the middle. I could hardly believe my eyes.

3. DiLuigi and Juice are effective runners.

4. Heaps passes very well when taking snaps from under center.

5. Reverse on the kickoff was a welcome change. I'm glad to know trick plays are not against BYU's honor code. I had to wonder.

The Bad:

1. Two sure touchdowns were dropped by receivers (here's looking at you Ashworth).

2. We only passed over the middle to a tight end once.

3. Play calling is still questionable.

4. Heaps missed several wide open receivers.

5. Our coaches have no idea when to go for it or punt. After a team just finishes a 21 play drive taking 9 minutes off the clock--you don't give it back intentionally. Field goal not my favorite call since we had a managable fourth down and were in the red zone, but fine. I get it. We were down by three scores so we needed a field goal anyway. But it better be followed up by an onside kick. Instead, we kick offeven though our defense was not stopping them at all.

Anyway, I am very excited about the future with our young players. Heaps and Juice are both going to be gamers. It will be fun to watch them progress this year, even if we can't expect a win every game.

runbyu1

9/26/2010, 5:15:18 PM

Cougarfan87 wrote:

The Good:

1. Hoffman made some great grabs.

2. We passed to a Tight End over the middle. I could hardly believe my eyes.

3. DiLuigi and Juice are effective runners.

4. Heaps passes very well when taking snaps from under center.

5. Reverse on the kickoff was a welcome change. I'm glad to know trick plays are not against BYU's honor code. I had to wonder.

The Bad:

1. Two sure touchdowns were dropped by receivers (here's looking at you Ashworth).

2. We only passed over the middle to a tight end once.

3. Play calling is still questionable.

4. Heaps missed several wide open receivers.

5. Our coaches have no idea when to go for it or punt. After a team just finishes a 21 play drive taking 9 minutes off the clock--you don't give it back intentionally. Field goal not my favorite call since we had a managable fourth down and were in the red zone, but fine. I get it. We were down by three scores so we needed a field goal anyway. But it better be followed up by an onside kick. Instead, we kick offeven though our defense was not stopping them at all.

Anyway, I am very excited about the future with our young players. Heaps and Juice are both going to be gamers. It will be fun to watch them progress this year, even if we can't expect a win every game.

Great post, great points. Juice looked good. Heaps needs to take more snaps from under center, he's said himself that it's where he's most comfortable. Playcalling is killing our team. We def need more tight end action!

CAFB_04-12

9/26/2010, 6:05:22 PM

On the bright side, we won't have to worry about anyone making a similar decision re: QBs for another three seasons...

imuakahuku

9/26/2010, 6:59:20 PM

I posted this in another thread too but I have to disagree with you Tux because of point #2.

I see it as Jake is a month or two behind. Had he been taking reps since the start of fall camp I am quite certain we would have won yesterday. They would not have had the ball as often and we would have scored on nearly every drive. That said I have two thoughts about the effect that the two QB system had on our team.

#1 First thought is that had Heaps been given the reins from the beginning of fall camp we would have won at least the Nevada game. The AF game would probably have been a loss but may have been more competitive. FSU might have been a closer game so we may have had better chances of winning either of those games.

#2 But I lean more to the idea that had Bronco chosen a starter it would have been Riley. Which in effect would have reduced the number of reps that Jake actually did receive which would mean he would be even farther behind than he is now. So in my opinnion it actually turns out to be a struck of good luck that Bronco went with the two qb's since Riley went down for the season. I do expect that after this season barring some sort of incredulous mental breakdown, the Heaps era is now here and Riley will be the situational QB the next couple of seasons (if he is eligible for a medical exemption).

Guest

9/26/2010, 8:39:15 PM

Where is everyone crying about how they don't want to change our offense to the QB? Everyone knows the shotgun is our bread and butter.

Lawboy

9/26/2010, 8:54:48 PM

Beck did not go shotgun as much as Max. So I think the shotgun is used to fit the QB. I think Jake is better under center more personally, and we should use that formation more than the spread with him, but still use it.

The issue with Jake is that he has not learned yet to focus on just moving the chains, and not go for the HR ball too much. Moving the chains, with the big play mixed in works for us. Hoping for a big play means too many fades, holding on to the ball in the pocket too long waiting for the play to develop. Jake needs to see the hot receiver faster and hit that guy more. Like, a TE quick over the middle. jake just is not seeing that yet, and it has been a BYU staple for years. Once he gets that timing down, things will be fine. Until then, we struggle a great deal as we are now.

scott715

9/28/2010, 1:56:40 AM

It seems that Jake is very good at play action. A couple of times in the game I thought he had handed the ball off.

YBrit

9/28/2010, 2:01:00 AM

Okay, but if BYU loses to UNM. Which happened in 2004, which stopped us from being bowl eligible then and will now.

I am rightfully calling Bronco and Anae: Crowtonites.

Mars

9/28/2010, 7:19:58 AM

hawkwing wrote:
Where is everyone crying about how they don't want to change our offense to the QB? Everyone knows the shotgun is our bread and butter.

BYU's offense is a passing offense, whether we pass out of the shotgun or from under center. Either way, it's a passing offense. Not a running offense. Not an option offense. A passing offense.

Even Bronco was crying about it after the Air Force game.

Cougarfan87

9/28/2010, 2:54:21 PM

Mars wrote:
Where is everyone crying about how they don't want to change our offense to the QB? Everyone knows the shotgun is our bread and butter.

BYU's offense is a passing offense, whether we pass out of the shotgun or from under center. Either way, it's a passing offense. Not a running offense. Not an option offense. A passing offense.

Even Bronco was crying about it after the Air Force game.

Concur. Running passing plays from under center helps young QBs develop a rythym. One, two, three, throw (short pass plays). Or One, two, three, four, five, throw (Intermediate pass plays). Or on really long plays, one, two, three, four, five, six, seven throw. A nine step drop would just be ridiculous, although I hear back in the day Jimmy Mac used to do nine step drops.

At any rate, I agree with Mars that it doesn't change the fundamental nature of your offense. BYU offenses of the past always played from under center, and still spread the field with the passing game. Taking snaps from center also helps QBs be more NFL ready, although admittedly that is Heap's goal, not BYU's.

runbyu1

9/28/2010, 4:11:09 PM

All I know is that Heaps has said he'd be more comfortable taking more plays under center---that's about all I need to hear. Not to mention we'll have better ability for play action, etc. This solves two problems: 1) gets the kid comfortable and 2) takes some pressure off of him

byufan4ever

9/28/2010, 5:30:47 PM

Bow down to Heaps and do whatever he wants. Heaps can do no wrong.

I realize that going from shotgun to under center may not be a huge change, but I firmly believe that if Heaps suddenly decided that he wanted to be an option QB that everyone on this board would be all for it just because Heaps wants it. Don't change the offense one bit for Nelson, but let's do whatever we can for Heaps.

BTW, I have nothing against Heaps, just can't stand the attitude of fans: hatred towards Nelson (which has softened only because he's now injured) and undying love for Heaps.

Brayden Green

9/28/2010, 11:38:16 PM

byufan4ever wrote:
Bow down to Heaps and do whatever he wants. Heaps can do no wrong.

I realize that going from shotgun to under center may not be a huge change, but I firmly believe that if Heaps suddenly decided that he wanted to be an option QB that everyone on this board would be all for it just because Heaps wants it. Don't change the offense one bit for Nelson, but let's do whatever we can for Heaps.

BTW, I have nothing against Heaps, just can't stand the attitude of fans: hatred towards Nelson (which has softened only because he's now injured) and undying love for Heaps.

Okay, Sno jr.

Mars

9/29/2010, 5:41:14 AM

BlueIsBetter wrote:

Bow down to Heaps and do whatever he wants. Heaps can do no wrong... can't stand the attitude of fans: hatred towards Nelson (which has softened only because he's now injured) and undying love for Heaps.

Okay, Sno jr.

:lol:

(my thoughts exactly)

scott715

10/1/2010, 4:16:27 AM

They are probably doing shotgun to give him time to see the field. But if he is more comfortable doing play action that might get the receivers more open then the should be the best move.

Cougarbib

10/1/2010, 4:20:40 AM

The receivers have been open. He needs to hit them. If going from under center helps him plant the right (I mean left aka correct) foot - go for it

[ Post made via Mobile Device ]

http://cougarcorner.com/images/mobile.png" alt="" loading="lazy" style="max-width:100%">

runbyu1

10/1/2010, 4:57:26 PM

byufan4ever wrote:
Bow down to Heaps and do whatever he wants. Heaps can do no wrong.

I realize that going from shotgun to under center may not be a huge change, but I firmly believe that if Heaps suddenly decided that he wanted to be an option QB that everyone on this board would be all for it just because Heaps wants it. Don't change the offense one bit for Nelson, but let's do whatever we can for Heaps.

BTW, I have nothing against Heaps, just can't stand the attitude of fans: hatred towards Nelson (which has softened only because he's now injured) and undying love for Heaps.

Dude, chill. All I said is he is more comfortable with under center...not that he was demanding it. Also, I was a big Nelson proponent and am still bummed he's not in there running a Wildcat offense every few downs. I don't see the complete Heaps worship you're talking about.

CannonCougar85

10/1/2010, 6:04:37 PM

I'm pretty sure Jake Heaps knew exactly what he was getting himself into when he committed to BYU. He knew when he was getting recruited that he'd be in the shotgun 90% of the time at BYU and he still committed. So sure he may be more comfortable under center but I'm pretty sure he is very willing to become a shotgun QB or else he wouldn't be here.

Lawboy

10/1/2010, 6:32:07 PM

CannonCougar85 wrote:
I'm pretty sure Jake Heaps knew exactly what he was getting himself into when he committed to BYU. He knew when he was getting recruited that he'd be in the shotgun 90% of the time at BYU and he still committed. So sure he may be more comfortable under center but I'm pretty sure he is very willing to become a shotgun QB or else he wouldn't be here.

All I can tell you is that I heard it right from the mouth of someone who knows Jake really well, and he said Jake will be under center more, as soon as next year. It was after the FSU game I was told this, and the source was Jake's dad. Said the coaches had discussed it with Jake already.

Detmer was under center a ton, as were McMahon, Young, Sark and others. Believe it or not, it works pretty good for a passing offense. The spread is not the only way to throw it. I have always preferred under center myself, but I am just a fan, so what do I know really.

Page 1 of 2

This is an archived topic from the original CougarCorner forum. New replies are not accepted.