Archived Topic

We win if coaches use the kicking game correctly.

by craigoscarson · 9/26/2010

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C
craigoscarson
3 opportunities for field goals (4 if you count the last drive with a minute left)

Any 2 of those field goals cou;d have changed what we did the last 5 minutes



3 other opportunities to punt instead of go for it, and extend the field

who knows where we are if we win the field position battle



As shaky as our o-line is and using a true frosh qb... you have to have faith in the kicking game



That's how we won the UW game and that's how we would have won this one.
B
BroncoBot
eh, maybe. Maybe not.



Hindsight is 20-20.
M
Mars


You're joking right?



Down 17 points and we're gonna win by attempting three 42-yard-ish field goals?
L
Lawboy
When we were down 17 with like 11 minutes left in the 4th and ran a freaking sweep with Brian Kariya, yeah, we should have gone for 3 there. That play call was fine, the personnel for the play was the issue. Had it been JJ or Q, it was a first down. I love Kariya, but he is not fast enough to run a sweep with. Jake also blew a first down on his scramble where he dove for it instead of running through it and cutting back. He had it easy, but did not get it.



Our D stepped up late, but the O just lacks any real punch, especially in the red zone. We have issues this year we just are not used to.
J
jonnylingo
Lawboy wrote:
When we were down 17 with like 11 minutes left in the 4th and ran a freaking sweep with Brian Kariya, yeah, we should have gone for 3 there. That play call was fine, the personnel for the play was the issue. Had it been JJ or Q, it was a first down. I love Kariya, but he is not fast enough to run a sweep with. Jake also blew a first down on his scramble where he dove for it instead of running through it and cutting back. He had it easy, but did not get it.



Our D stepped up late, but the O just lacks any real punch, especially in the red zone. We have issues this year we just are not used to.


That play was not fine. Nevada's defense had personel in place ready for that play. Bronco should have called a time out and changed the play. You could see it was going to fail before it was played.



As to the kicking game. I am not sure I blame that on the loss. I blame our offense just not getting the stupid ball in the endzone. They drove the field very well but kept stalling when they got close to scoring. blue and red zone practice is in order. That is where having riley to send in would have helped, in those 'critical' situations.
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M
Mars


BYU drove inside Nevada's 25-yard line SIX times. That could have meant 42 points.



Instead, we settled for just one Touchdown. 1 out of 6.
R
runbyu1
Mars wrote:


BYU drove inside Nevada's 25-yard line SIX times. That could have meant 42 points.



Instead, we settled for just one Touchdown. 1 out of 6.


Very telling indeed. It seemed like we drove on them at will and then lost all juice when we got close. Play calling? Personnel?
I
Italics
runbyu1 wrote:


BYU drove inside Nevada's 25-yard line SIX times. That could have meant 42 points.



Instead, we settled for just one Touchdown. 1 out of 6.


Very telling indeed. It seemed like we drove on them at will and then lost all juice when we got close. Play calling? Personnel?


1) Multiple wasted downs on fade routes



2) Brian Kariya should never touch the ball when the game is on the line. Slow, makes poor decisions, and drops passes. He's also incapable of making plays, or "making something out of nothing." If he's running the ball and doesn't have terrific blocking - nothing. If he gets a pass thrown to him that isn't right on the money - nothing. Guy should not get the number of touches he gets in a game. Period.



And I think it's a HUGE stretch to say that we win the game with better kicking choices.



And yes, the redzone offense was horrific... even with play-calling aside. Poor running, dropped passes, and missed wide open receivers. This game was very winnable.
F
frdbtr
All of these issues are indicative of a young offense, particularly a freshman qb, that doesn't yet know how to finish drives. Patience is in order.
B
BroncoBot
I have nothing against Kariya. He's done no more or less than anyone else on the team to lose games for BYU. He's just currently the pinata for road rage BYU fans. As OU how if Kariya is slow, undependable, makes bad decisions, and has bad hands. The guy does his job and unfortunately doesn't break loose for 20 yard runs too often so fans are ready to cut his throat.



Pathetic.
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Mars
runbyu1 wrote:
BYU drove inside Nevada's 25-yard line SIX times. That could have meant 42 points. Instead, we settled for just one Touchdown. 1 out of 6.
Very telling indeed. It seemed like we drove on them at will and then lost all juice when we got close. Play calling? Personnel?

Good question. I think Robert Anae is using his personnel very, VERY poorly.



For example, let's look at who had TOUCHDOWNS in Fall Camp. In theory, these should be the players we are targetting in the Blue Zone for TDs:



McKay- 5 Catching TDs

Wilson- 4 Catching TDs

Chambers- 4 Catching TDs

JJ- 4 TDs (2 rushing, 2 catching)

Kariya- 4 Rushing TDs

Apo- 3 Catching TDs

Quezada- 3 TDs (2 rushing, 1 catching)

Mathews- 2 Catching TDs

Marshall- 2 Catching TDs

Hoffman- 2 Catching TDs



http://www.cougarcorner.com/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=3975&p=37252&hilit=fall+camp+stats#p37252" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;



In my opinion, we seem to try to go to guys like Ashworth and Hafoka FAAAR too often within the 20s; Ashworth didn't have a single TD in Fall Camp. And even JJ isn't nearly as good at scoring as he is gaining yards, once the defense starts bunching up (a power back like Quezada or even Kariya seems to be the better option for chewing up short yards in these situations). The best options are quick throws to the sidelines or medium routes across the middle to McKay, Wilson, Chambers, Apo, Matthews, Marshall, and Hoffman. McKay is getting the ball more now that we have Heaps as QB. Chambers should get the ball plenty once he comes back. Hopefully Apo becomes our #1 receiver target once he comes back (fingers crossed for your brain's abilities coaches). Coaches are finally catching on with Hoffman. Wilson was used a lot against Washington, but also dropped some balls and is now seemingly being phased out some, a little unnecessarily (like JJ was against Air Force by dumb Anae). Marcus Mathews, in my opinion, is a huge cog that coaches are completely missing out on by not putting him in and not throwing him the ball, it seems like a ridiculous oversight by this point. And how many times have you seen a simple crossing pattern thrown to Matt Marshall out of the slot this year? He was effective in practice. He hasn't dropped a single ball yet this year, in fall camp or in games. They need to put him in and try the play live, it can't be worse than what we saw against Nevada.



Not impressed with the personnel decision making at all so far.
C
Cougarbib
We seem to have drifted a little off topic here - but back to punting and field position and the need to have confidence in the punting game.



Yeah - usually - especially if you think your d might stop them eventually - otherwise try to get some points.



Craig rightly so points out the special player of the week performance of the MWC week punting in helping beat UW. I agree.



Craig did not mention the 1 yard punt followed by the 12 yard punt that helped lose another game. Or the 2 yard Rugby punt that helped lose this game. But maybe the conventional punt at home is reliable enough - just be wary of it on the road.



Re the drifted topic - performance in practice - for freshmen - is not a great predictor of performance on the field in chaos and heat. Reference Jake Heaps as one example and almost any tight end. Look at who is scoring the points at game time and go with them.



But if we are going to develop the kids - we may have to let them make mistakes and hope they stay healthy and learn while making them. I do want to see a little more Juice but also do not want to see Heaps hauled off on a stretcher if a block is missed.



And I am finally on board with shooting the veterans and firing the coaches.



So put your dream staff together. Fire Bronco first. List below all of the replacements u would like to see but first they must be willing to work for less than half what June Jones got at SMU while hearing fans whine about the big bucks they get paid.



Make your list. UW fans will let u have Sark if you want him. He makes more money though as a rookie HC. Oh, I forgot - Bronco beat him and his senior heisman #1 pick QB and returning 100 yard rusher and all everything returning receiver. Scratch Sark. Who else!



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C
CougarPeasant
Cougarbib2 wrote:
We seem to have drifted a little off topic here - but back to punting and field position and the need to have confidence in the punting game.



Yeah - usually - especially if you think your d might stop them eventually - otherwise try to get some points.



Craig rightly so points out the special player of the week performance of the MWC week punting in helping beat UW. I agree.



Craig did not mention the 1 yard punt followed by the 12 yard punt that helped lose another game. Or the 2 yard Rugby punt that helped lose this game. But maybe the conventional punt at home is reliable enough - just be wary of it on the road.



Re the drifted topic - performance in practice - for freshmen - is not a great predictor of performance on the field in chaos and heat. Reference Jake Heaps as one example and almost any tight end. Look at who is scoring the points at game time and go with them.



But if we are going to develop the kids - we may have to let them make mistakes and hope they stay healthy and learn while making them. I do want to see a little more Juice but also do not want to see Heaps hauled off on a stretcher if a block is missed.



And I am finally on board with shooting the veterans and firing the coaches.



So put your dream staff together. Fire Bronco first. List below all of the replacements u would like to see but first they must be willing to work for less than half what June Jones got at SMU while hearing fans whine about the big bucks they get paid.



Make your list. UW fans will let u have Sark if you want him. He makes more money though as a rookie HC. Oh, I forgot - Bronco beat him and his senior heisman #1 pick QB and returning 100 yard rusher and all everything returning receiver. Scratch Sark. Who else!

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That made me laugh. Well played Sir.
B
Brayden Green
Cougarbib2 wrote:
We seem to have drifted a little off topic here - but back to punting and field position and the need to have confidence in the punting game.



Yeah - usually - especially if you think your d might stop them eventually - otherwise try to get some points.



Craig rightly so points out the special player of the week performance of the MWC week punting in helping beat UW. I agree.



Craig did not mention the 1 yard punt followed by the 12 yard punt that helped lose another game. Or the 2 yard Rugby punt that helped lose this game. But maybe the conventional punt at home is reliable enough - just be wary of it on the road.



Re the drifted topic - performance in practice - for freshmen - is not a great predictor of performance on the field in chaos and heat. Reference Jake Heaps as one example and almost any tight end. Look at who is scoring the points at game time and go with them.



But if we are going to develop the kids - we may have to let them make mistakes and hope they stay healthy and learn while making them. I do want to see a little more Juice but also do not want to see Heaps hauled off on a stretcher if a block is missed.



And I am finally on board with shooting the veterans and firing the coaches.



So put your dream staff together. Fire Bronco first. List below all of the replacements u would like to see but first they must be willing to work for less than half what June Jones got at SMU while hearing fans whine about the big bucks they get paid.



Make your list. UW fans will let u have Sark if you want him. He makes more money though as a rookie HC. Oh, I forgot - Bronco beat him and his senior heisman #1 pick QB and returning 100 yard rusher and all everything returning receiver. Scratch Sark. Who else!



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Nobody is talking about firing Bronco. Show me where anyone has said that.
Y
YNot
Mars wrote:


BYU drove inside Nevada's 25-yard line SIX times. That could have meant 42 points.



Instead, we settled for just one Touchdown. 1 out of 6.


I think this is the point of the original post. Even with 1 out of 6 resulting in a Touchdown, we should have had 4 other opportunities that resulted in Field Goals (for a total score of 19) and one last chance in the final minutes to score a touchdown and 2-point conversion and at least take the game to overtime; 27-27.



Of course, we will never know whether a closer score would have encouraged Nevada's offense to pass and score more (if they could), rather than run out the clock....



The point is also very well made in previous posts that we need to freaking put the ball in the end zone!
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Mars
YNot wrote:
BYU drove inside Nevada's 25-yard line SIX times. That could have meant 42 points. Instead, we settled for just one Touchdown. 1 out of 6.
Even with 1 out of 6 resulting in a Touchdown, we should have had 4 other opportunities that resulted in Field Goals (for a total score of 19) and one last chance in the final minutes to score a touchdown and 2-point conversion and at least take the game to overtime; 27-27. Of course, we will never know whether a closer score would have encouraged Nevada's offense to pass and score more (if they could), rather than run out the clock...



The point is also very well made in previous posts that we need to freaking put the ball in the end zone!

Nevada held the ball for more time in the 2nd half than they did in the 1st, and though the points and punt totals were vastly different, first downs and 3rd down completions weren't. Which does make it seem like Nevada could have scored more TDs if they were pushed to by a scoring BYU offense, but they weren't, so they were content to hold onto the ball and run out the clock to get out of town as soon as possible with the win. We'll never know.



An onside kick by BYU coaches wouldn't have hurt.
I
Italics
declocoug wrote:
I have nothing against Kariya. He's done no more or less than anyone else on the team to lose games for BYU. He's just currently the pinata for road rage BYU fans. As OU how if Kariya is slow, undependable, makes bad decisions, and has bad hands. The guy does his job and unfortunately doesn't break loose for 20 yard runs too often so fans are ready to cut his throat.



Pathetic.


Yeah, his YPC are pretty phenomenal... what were we thinking...
I
Italics
Mars wrote:
Mars wrote:
Which does make it seem like Nevada could have scored more TDs if they were pushed to by a scoring BYU offense, but they weren't, so they were content to hold onto the ball and run out the clock to get out of town as soon as possible with the win.


Which is why I don't get why BYU holding Nevada to 27 points was such a big deal. I saw absolutely no evidence in the game that we had an answer for Nevada's offense.
B
Brayden Green
Italics wrote:
YNot wrote:
Which does make it seem like Nevada could have scored more TDs if they were pushed to by a scoring BYU offense, but they weren't, so they were content to hold onto the ball and run out the clock to get out of town as soon as possible with the win.


Which is why I don't get why BYU holding Nevada to 27 points was such a big deal. I saw absolutely no evidence in the game that we had an answer for Nevada's offense.


Exactly. When a team ushers in a 20 play, 8 minute + drive, why is everyone running around so confident that the defense did fine. Just one of the many miracles of the bend and break defense.
C
Cougarbib
Because they didn't score a TD and that was just one drive.



Nevada was rattled - when they threw the ball later we got a pick.



Nevada's coach was quoted after the game saying their offense did not play well in the 2nd half - exact words.



He did not credit defensive adjustments by BYU directly but said that the did not play well in the 2nd half.



He would not have said that if they just went conservative and executed well at just grinding clock.



The BYU D was not perfect, but they gave Nevada problems in the 2nd half.



And iirc, that long drive was extended by a bad call - might be wrong and don't remember the call - was that the Fuga clipping drive?



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