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Coach Doman on Riley Nelson

by frdbtr · 9/15/2010

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frdbtr
If anyone is interested in hearing the coach's opinion on Riley Nelson listen to his interview today. There is no question that Doman thinks that Riley can be successful with our offense as long as the offense is taylored to his strengths. He says that he feels terrible that they asked Riley to do things that he was not capable of doing on Saturday, he gave 100% and limped off the field. He says that he will carry that with him forever that he failed as a coach on Saturday. You guys that are criticizing him need to lighten up. Coach is right, Riley gave 100% to a game plan that was not going to work. It is up to the coaches to prepare these guys to be successful. It is time to quit this 2 QB thing and pick a guy and prepare him to be successful.
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byutx
So they'll "tailor" out all the passing if Riley is to be the guy, I assume?



This is getting ridiculous.
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frdbtr
byutx wrote:
So they'll "tailor" out all the passing if Riley is to be the guy, I assume?



This is getting ridiculous.


Your stubborn, hard headed negativity is getting old. Did you listen to the interview before posting this crap? :angry:
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byutx
frdbtr wrote:
So they'll "tailor" out all the passing if Riley is to be the guy, I assume?



This is getting ridiculous.


Your stubborn, hard headed negativity is getting old. Did you listen to the interview before posting this crap? :angry:

Deja vu all over again.



That's the thing that's crazy about all this-I'm not negative. Look at my entire body of work. Stubborn? Oh yeah. Hard headed? sure. Hard hearted? Sometimes. But negative? No, not really.



Basically, any plan that involves Riley as the long term guy, IMO (note the "O") is a waste of time, talent and a season. If he's the guy next year, it will be the biggest waste in the history of sports.



also, I'm prone to hyperbole
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frdbtr
byutx wrote:
byutx wrote:
So they'll "tailor" out all the passing if Riley is to be the guy, I assume?



This is getting ridiculous.


Your stubborn, hard headed negativity is getting old. Did you listen to the interview before posting this crap? :angry:

Deja vu all over again.



That's the thing that's crazy about all this-I'm not negative. Look at my entire body of work. Stubborn? Oh yeah. Hard headed? sure. Hard hearted? Sometimes. But negative? No, not really.



Basically, any plan that involves Riley as the long term guy, IMO (note the "O") is a waste of time, talent and a season. If he's the guy next year, it will be the biggest waste in the history of sports.



also, I'm prone to hyperbole


You are posting in ignorance because you have not listened to the interview. You are saying that "tayloring the offense" is code for not throwing the ball anymore when Doman answers the "taylor the offense" comment very intelligently. I am not going to answer anymore of your posts until you listen to the interview. Just like in your "fire Anae" thread. You read one comment that left out 99.9% of the context it was in and decided that Anae is a loser and needs to be fired. If you don't know what you are talking about, you shouldn't comment.
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byutx
Explain to me how one would go about tailoring our offense to fit a guy with the wrong skillset based on: the offense we've run (more or less) for decades? the type of players we've recruited? specifically the type of OL's we have? the strength on our O-receivers and TE's? I can't imagine an offense much different than the one riley played in the AFA game-maybe with less passes? I don't know. I do know that Riley can't make the throws necessary to force the D to respect his arm. He has a decent arm for a Utah high schooler. I'm not sure he'd start as QB at the better 5A schools here in Texas (borrowed this thought from a good friend of mine) excepting, of course, the ones that run the option almost exclusively.
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Gunk
byutx wrote:
Explain to me how one would go about tailoring our offense to fit a guy with the wrong skillset based on: the offense we've run (more or less) for decades? the type of players we've recruited? specifically the type of OL's we have? the strength on our O-receivers and TE's? I can't imagine an offense much different than the one riley played in the AFA game-maybe with less passes? I don't know. I do know that Riley can't make the throws necessary to force the D to respect his arm. He has a decent arm for a Utah high schooler. I'm not sure he'd start as QB at the better 5A schools here in Texas (borrowed this thought from a good friend of mine) excepting, of course, the ones that run the option almost exclusively.


I shudder at the thought of an offense tailored for Nelson...BYU football would get mighty boring real fast.
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IndiCoug
I don't recall anyone saying Riley didn't give it his all or 100%. I think he absolutely gave it his all but sometimes we just don't have enough which doesn't make it his fault but with what was thrown his way by AF (for that one game) his performance was weighed and found lacking (BYU lost).

I still don't understand what Anea and Doman asked of him that he couldn't perform or never practiced. He ran, tucked and ran, option ran, QB draw ran, and sprinkled an attempted pass in every so often. That pretty much covers it.

All in all it was a HUGE error that apparently none of the coaches want to fess-up to.

I just hope they've been game planning for FSU for at least part of the off season so we can at least have a good showing.
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Matty-B
IMO:

BYU should not change a thing in their offensive scheme. BYU has found success in their offense for the last handful of years so why change that???

Bronco has said that Heaps and Nelson are EQUAL and that no one is ahead of the other.

Then why the hell don't you use the QB that fits WAY better in an already successful system?

I don't understand it.
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Brayden Green
frdbtr wrote:
You are posting in ignorance because you have not listened to the interview. You are saying that "tayloring the offense" is code for not throwing the ball anymore when Doman answers the "taylor the offense" comment very intelligently. I am not going to answer anymore of your posts until you listen to the interview. Just like in your "fire Anae" thread. You read one comment that left out 99.9% of the context it was in and decided that Anae is a loser and needs to be fired. If you don't know what you are talking about, you shouldn't comment.


BYUtx pisses out more BYU information on a daily basis, than most of us on this board will ever know, probably even combined. If he is too much of a nice guy to confront you, and show you that, then that is why. Hot headed posts like these from you here, and the Anae thread are what ruined him from posting on CB on a regular basis, and what has ruined him from posting here in the past. God gave you two ears (in this case, eyes) and one mouth (well, two hands, that doesn't work... :) ).



You would be wise to listen to what he has to say, and internalize it, whether or not you agree with it. You will find that if you don't have an agenda (and haven't been listening to "takes" on Jim Rome recently) that he is right a lot more often than he isn't.



Sorry for being blunt, or vulgar if I offended anyone. Sorry mods, it needed to be said.
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Mars
byutx wrote:
So they'll "tailor" out all the passing if Riley is to be the guy, I assume?



This is getting ridiculous.

Amen.

Simply stated, but well said.



I'm more than ready for Bronco, Anae, and Doman to stand up and admit: "You know that whole run-first starting BYU QB idea? Whoops! Our bad. Terrible idea, but we're gonna work hard and do our best to put that behind us now..."
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mizzoucoug
I don't know what it is about your mindset, FDBTR (or whatever), but I disagree with pretty much everything you say. It's almost like you are either being too PC about the whole situation, sucking up to the "Phd coaches," or you really have no more grasp of this game than your common Provo social BYU football fan.
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snoscythe
If anyone bothers listening to Doman's interview, three things are crystal clear:



1) It was Anae's decision to go exclusively with Nelson in the second half, not Doman's

2) Doman thinks Nelson can be a very effective passer with the right package of plays (think bootlegs, screens, and tailbacks in the flats).

3) Doman thinks the game plan for the second half was the entirely wrong package for Nelson's ability. A "good idea, terrible execution" thing.
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frdbtr
mizzoucoug wrote:
I don't know what it is about your mindset, FDBTR (or whatever), but I disagree with pretty much everything you say. It's almost like you are either being too PC about the whole situation, sucking up to the "Phd coaches," or you really have no more grasp of this game than your common Provo social BYU football fan.


And you are so blind with your man crush on Heaps that you twist everything that the coaches say into a negative. I have no motives to kiss up to any of the coaches. I have never met any of them personally. I am a BYU fan first and whatever is going to lead to victory is what I am in favor of. I also trust that the coaches are doing what they think is going to get us victories since that is their livelyhood and they get fired if they don't succeed at it. I am not the most knowledgable fan, I will never claim that. When I listen to the coaches talk, I don't look for thinks to critcize which is what is going on here, with all you Heaps worshippers. If you will go back and look at ANY of my posts, I will come to the defense of any player to the unfounded accusations and criticisms that are leveled here. I think that blanket statements on the ability of these student athletes is compeltely assinine since most of us on this board never played a down of football past high school.



My thread here, was to point out that Riley Nelson COULD in fact lead BYU effectively if he were given the ball and gameplanned for. Heaps could do it too. Im completely SICK of the Nelson bashing going on here. He is a young man that wanted to beat AF in the worst way, he left it on the field 100% in and unsuccessfull situation due to poor coaching. Doman admitted that and all I hear on this board is that he is a bum and needs to be kicked off the team for incompetence so that the god Heaps can ride in on his white horse and save us from a certain losing season. Sorry if this sounds like "sucking up" to the "phd" coaches.
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mizzoucoug
frdbtr wrote:
I don't know what it is about your mindset, FDBTR (or whatever), but I disagree with pretty much everything you say. It's almost like you are either being too PC about the whole situation, sucking up to the "Phd coaches," or you really have no more grasp of this game than your common Provo social BYU football fan.


And you are so blind with your man crush on Heaps that you twist everything that the coaches say into a negative. I have no motives to kiss up to any of the coaches. I have never met any of them personally. I am a BYU fan first and whatever is going to lead to victory is what I am in favor of. I also trust that the coaches are doing what they think is going to get us victories since that is their livelyhood and they get fired if they don't succeed at it. I am not the most knowledgable fan, I will never claim that. When I listen to the coaches talk, I don't look for thinks to critcize which is what is going on here, with all you Heaps worshippers. If you will go back and look at ANY of my posts, I will come to the defense of any player to the unfounded accusations and criticisms that are leveled here. I think that blanket statements on the ability of these student athletes is compeltely assinine since most of us on this board never played a down of football past high school.



My thread here, was to point out that Riley Nelson COULD in fact lead BYU effectively if he were given the ball and gameplanned for. Heaps could do it too. Im completely SICK of the Nelson bashing going on here. He is a young man that wanted to beat AF in the worst way, he left it on the field 100% in and unsuccessfull situation due to poor coaching. Doman admitted that and all I hear on this board is that he is a bum and needs to be kicked off the team for incompetence so that the god Heaps can ride in on his white horse and save us from a certain losing season. Sorry if this sounds like "sucking up" to the "phd" coaches.


I don't know who you are referring to but I have no man-crush on Heaps and I don't hate Riley. The AFA game was a loss either way and I have never even thought that Jake would've won it for us. Although, come on, with Nelson in the game down 2 TD's there was in fact zero chance of doing anything.



But you are sucking up to the coaches and being PC by saying that you put your trust in them gameplanning for Riley and being his apologist. Do you have any idea how impossible it would be to set up the option offense for BYU at this point in the year!? Be realistic man. Riley cannot consistently complete passes over 10 yards because that is not his game (and if your response to that is that throwing screens and 2 yard dumps is the gameplan then what do secondaries have to respect against Nelson?). He cannot throw the out pattern. And he cannot make it through his progressions without getting the itch to run, which further compounds the frustrations of receivers who also give it 100% running their routes but know there is little chance of the ball coming their way. This is analysis, not hate.



And this year is a rebuilding year so our best bet is to get the Heaps train going when the losses are probably going to come anyway. Next year is the big stage and if we're still breaking in Heaps on ESPN against OU, we are screwed.
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snoscythe
mizzoucoug wrote:
Do you have any idea how impossible it would be to set up the option offense for BYU at this point in the year!? Be realistic man. Riley cannot consistently complete passes over 10 yards because that is not his game. He cannot throw the out pattern. And he cannot make it through his progressions without getting the itch to run, which further compounds the frustrations of receivers who also give it 100% running their routes but know there is little chance of the ball coming their way. This is analysis, not hate.


Again. Listen to the interview. Doman is talking about tailoring a passing offense that fits Nelson's ability and talents. He is not talking about tailoring the entire offense to Nelson's legs, he is talking about tailoring the passing offense so we are not asking him to do things that he cannot do consistently. There were no screens, boot legs, or tailbacks slipping to the flats in the second half against AFA. These are all passes that Nelson can make that would be especially effective if the defense is stacking the box like they were on Saturday. This is what Doman was talking about--an effective passing gameplan that is within his abilities and either punishes a defense for selling out to stop him running or forces linebackers to be honest in pass coverage and opens up running lanes for Nelson that weren't there Saturday.



The last thing he was talking about was going to option football--if anything, Doman earmarked overdependence on the option as a mistake.



I think you could avoid much embarrassment by simply taking two minutes to listen to the interview. You have already spent more time than that in misconstruing remarks you haven't heard.
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Brayden Green
Against Texas, so we're more screwed.



Texas > OU almost every year
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pjmuli
frdbtr wrote:
My thread here, was to point out that Riley Nelson COULD in fact lead BYU effectively if he were given the ball and gameplanned for. Heaps could do it too. Im completely SICK of the Nelson bashing going on here. He is a young man that wanted to beat AF in the worst way, he left it on the field 100% in and unsuccessfull situation due to poor coaching. Doman admitted that and all I hear on this board is that he is a bum and needs to be kicked off the team for incompetence so that the god Heaps can ride in on his white horse and save us from a certain losing season. Sorry if this sounds like "sucking up" to the "phd" coaches.


Ok...here is my issue with this line of logic. Yes, Doman said that he felt bad for Riley and that they put him in a position where he would not succeed. However, when pressed about why they would put Riley in that position instead of inserting Jake Heaps, Doman deferred that question to Anae, basically saying that it was not Doman's decision.



I think all on this board can agree to a few things:



#1 - Riley Nelson is a fine young man and a tremendous athletic talent.

#2 - We are fortunate to have Riley in the football program because he can do some very special things.

#3 - Riley is a gritty and determined leader

#4 - Riley does not throw the ball well consistently at the college level - and he never really has.

#5 - Most of us do not see positive outcomes from a two quarterback system, now or in the future

#6 - If BYU is going to be successful, it will be because of an effective passing game. Most of us do not see Riley becoming truly effective in the passing game sharing 50% of the reps.

#7 - Most of us would assume that if you have one quarterback or the other taking 90% of the reps in practice and snaps in games, Jake Heaps would ultimately lead us to better places quicker.

#8 - Frankly, in the past three years we have seen some rather odd and bone-headed coaching decisions. While they are the exception to the rule, they are so grossly foolish that EVERYONE is going to wonder why (a) we are even bothering with a two quarterback system and (b) why Riley Nelson would be the one getting the majority of snaps in games.



I think if you read the posts carefully, the posters are giving their honest assessment of what they have seen in Riley and in the playcalling during one of the most embarrassing performances in BYU history. It may seem negative, but I am sorry, Saturday was ugly...and to try and paint it any other way is disingenuous.



It is time to ditch the 2qb system and time to return to the tradition of BYU...consistency in an effective passing game.



I just don't think Riley fits that vision.



J
Y
Y12
We need to tailor our offense to our team. This is still a team sport. Can it be done with Riley as the quarterback? Maybe, but let's stop focusing so much on the quarterback and get back to the team.
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frdbtr
pjmuli wrote:
My thread here, was to point out that Riley Nelson COULD in fact lead BYU effectively if he were given the ball and gameplanned for. Heaps could do it too. Im completely SICK of the Nelson bashing going on here. He is a young man that wanted to beat AF in the worst way, he left it on the field 100% in and unsuccessfull situation due to poor coaching. Doman admitted that and all I hear on this board is that he is a bum and needs to be kicked off the team for incompetence so that the god Heaps can ride in on his white horse and save us from a certain losing season. Sorry if this sounds like "sucking up" to the "phd" coaches.


Ok...here is my issue with this line of logic. Yes, Doman said that he felt bad for Riley and that they put him in a position where he would not succeed. However, when pressed about why they would put Riley in that position instead of inserting Jake Heaps, Doman deferred that question to Anae, basically saying that it was not Doman's decision.



I think all on this board can agree to a few things:



#1 - Riley Nelson is a fine young man and a tremendous athletic talent.

#2 - We are fortunate to have Riley in the football program because he can do some very special things.

#3 - Riley is a gritty and determined leader

#4 - Riley does not throw the ball well consistently at the college level - and he never really has.

#5 - Most of us do not see positive outcomes from a two quarterback system, now or in the future

#6 - If BYU is going to be successful, it will be because of an effective passing game. Most of us do not see Riley becoming truly effective in the passing game sharing 50% of the reps.

#7 - Most of us would assume that if you have one quarterback or the other taking 90% of the reps in practice and snaps in games, Jake Heaps would ultimately lead us to better places quicker.

#8 - Frankly, in the past three years we have seen some rather odd and bone-headed coaching decisions. While they are the exception to the rule, they are so grossly foolish that EVERYONE is going to wonder why (a) we are even bothering with a two quarterback system and (b) why Riley Nelson would be the one getting the majority of snaps in games.



I think if you read the posts carefully, the posters are giving their honest assessment of what they have seen in Riley and in the playcalling during one of the most embarrassing performances in BYU history. It may seem negative, but I am sorry, Saturday was ugly...and to try and paint it any other way is disingenuous.



It is time to ditch the 2qb system and time to return to the tradition of BYU...consistency in an effective passing game.



I just don't think Riley fits that vision.



J


That is a good post and I agree with you that the 2 QB experiment is a mistake. I also think that Heaps is the future. Where I disagree is that Riley can't be an effective passer since a far more knowledgable mind about offensive football (Brandon Doman) said that an offense structured for his strengths would make him an effective passer. Frankly, I was hoping that Heaps would be named the starter for the FSU game and prepared all week. I am also sick of the Nelson bashing and would like to distract fans from that right now, which naming Heaps as the starter would do that. I don't know if he would be effective or not but it seems like it would have to be more effective then trying to prepare 2 guys and then benching one during the game.
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