Kyle Gunther (1280 TheZone) says that Jake...

Ok, I know most of us hate the guy and question his analyses, BUT, notwithstanding his self-serving ways and healthy BYU hatred (to be expected of a former Ute)....

He said after watching the BYU game several times, "That Jake was the most talented player on the field saturday", of both teams. He said he was "bleeping amazing."

I finished my errand and had ot quit listening before he got to jake's "very coachable improvements" needed, but he said he was very impressed. He even said that while he needs experience, there is not a better QB in the west, including barkley @ USC.

Ok, I was already a believer and I'm not all of a sudden giddy. BUt when your enemy can tout the guy....thought some of you would be interested--or just ready to start up another online fight. :-)

Hey, thanks for the post. It's always nice to see when a heretic begins to see the light. ;)

Thing is, if you do not acknowledge the talent with Jake, you are dumb. And I mean DUMB. There is no doubt that at this point in progression, as an 18 year old freshman, he is as talented as they come, as skilled, mechanically and technically, and very poised. No doubt about it. He just needs to get over the inexperience hump, and them we can watch him get to the next level. Guys like Gunther and Locke are just acknowledging the obvious fact of the matter.

Side note true confession...I really enjoy listening to Gunther. He's much more witty and quick on his feet than the Janimal, and he is genuinely funny. I'd much rather listen to 1280 than KALL 700. Bill Riley is the biggest U homer in the world. As long as I'm in the spirit of full disclosure, I also like long walks in the rain...and puppies...better yet...taking a puppy for a long walk in the rain. Yeah, that's the ticket...

How about Pina Coladas?



[youtube]QVdhZwK7cS8[/youtube]

Jake may have been the most talented player on the field on Saturday. But he certainly wasn't the best player on the field. BYU two best offensive players were Riley Nelson and JJ DiLuigi.

I wondered when you would show up Kitic. Where's Sno? :-)

Kitic... seriously? You really need to stop being so sensitive and defensive about Riley or its going to be a very long season for all of us that enjoy this site. If your determined to set Gunther straight you better call up Coach Calhoun too because I think he had some nice things to say about the kid.



As far as JJ and Riley being the best player on the field Saturday... I personally am very partial to Mat Reynolds myself future NFL 1st round draft pick. Now thats some serious talent!

Riley played well, all credit to him. But Jake is still the future of BYU football, and Riley is still just in a caretaker position until Bronco is comfortable handing it over to Jake 100%. Not sure how anyone could even argue this point. Jake has NFL written all over him, Riley does not. But Riley is still a good player than can do some nice things for BYU when given the chance. He impressed me Saturday, but Jake will be the guy by season's end, and if not, come game 1 of 2011. Regardless of who plays what downs though, it is all about BYU winning for me.

airattack wrote:
Kitic... seriously? You really need to stop being so sensitive and defensive about Riley or its going to be a very long season for all of us that enjoy this site. If your determined to set Gunther straight you better call up Coach Calhoun too because I think he had some nice things to say about the kid.



As far as JJ and Riley being the best player on the field Saturday... I personally am very partial to Mat Reynolds myself future NFL 1st round draft pick. Now thats some serious talent!

I think you misread what Kitic said, especially where he admitted that Gunther/Calhoun were right: "Jake may have been the most talented player on the field."



However, talent doesn't translate to performance all of the time. Jake is poised to be the best QB BYU has ever fielded, but that doesn't mean he was the best QB on the field Saturday....he wasn't, and no one holds that against him. He is an 18 year old kid making a big step up, and his youth showed, as did his promise as he matured over the course of four quarters. All Kitic was doing was pointing out that talent isn't the same as performance.



If we are going to have an enjoyable season on the site like you want, everyone is going to have to be a lot less sensitive about criticism of the players. Even if you are related to the guy, no one on the team is perfect, and it's not betrayal to say as much.

I wasn't trying to diminish what Jake did in any way shape or form. Nor was I defensive or getting sensitive about Riley. Like Sno said, I was simply trying to say that Jake wasn't the best player on the field. Although, I think you can make an argument that he may have been our third best player.



I have never doubted Jake's talent. He was outplayed by JJ and Riley.



And like Sno said, talent and performance aren't the same thing. I think by the end of the year, there will be several games where Jake is both our best and most talented player.

I wouldn't be surprised if Coach made Riley the starting QB this year with Jake backing him up and then red shirting Jake next year.

urroner wrote:
I wouldn't be surprised if Coach made Riley the starting QB this year with Jake backing him up and then red shirting Jake next year.

Technically the first half has already happened as Riley started and likely will start against AF. Of course, Jake is getting an awful lot of "backup" time. Who knows what happens next year? But that certainly is a possibility. Although, I'd be more in favor of either naming Jake the starter next year or RSing him as opposed to running a two QB offense again.

Gents, my second post asking where Sno was, was all for fun. Dont we all agree on this stuff by now?

But if you are going to extend your "best player" on the field list, I'm not sure Jake makes Top Five.

Best talent?--now those lists/debate could be an interestingly useless thread to carry us through the week.

Better than the very aging argument of heaps vs nelson. Since they embrace it maybe we should as well.

So, check out the new thread--who knows maybe its silly, but could be meaty enough to distract posters from three more days of same ole, same ole

Here's a preview.



Top Ten Best Player that played vs UW (sort of a game MVP/contribution mixed with talent?)

1. Reynolds

2. Jorgenson

3. Nelson

4. Diluigi

5. Fuga

6. Rich

7. So'oto

8. Stephenson

9. Heaps

10.Chambers/Quezada/Jacobson (tie)



Top Ten Best Talent that played vs UW-

1. Reynolds

2. Heaps

3. Jorgenson

4. So'oto

5. Van Noy

6. Quezada

7. Hoffman

8. Holt

9. Wilson

10. Nelson

scott715 wrote:
How about Pina Coladas?



[youtube]QVdhZwK7cS8[/youtube]

Nice :)

Here's my guess on what will happen on Saturday against AF:



Because AF runs the option and practices everyday against running QBs, Nelson will not be able to run for much, and Nelson's passing is suspect (I watched the UW game again and Nelson was lucky not to have been picked twice in that game).



Heaps will be on target, will throw TDs, and will get more playing time on Saturday because he will sustain drives and throw TDs. It will become increasingly obvious how good Heaps is.



Nelson will still start against FSU, but will not have success. Heaps will play more in that game too because BYU will be playing catch up, and Heaps will show the country how good he is--especially against top teams.



Against Nevada, Heaps will be the starter, will not go on a mission, will not redshirt, but will be BYU's QB this year, next year, and the next, before he enters the NFL draft as the #1 QB.



The great thing Heaps has going for him this year is our offensive line, they give him time, he doesn't get sacked and beat up, he has time to find receivers, he has a quick, high release (which Nelson does not), and he is very accurate. The year is going to be more exciting than many of us thought.

bball, I have to agree with most of what you are saying. The timing is the biggest question mark.

So, the question, and maybe its worth a new thread since things seem to be quieting down on CC, is, if either qb is ineffective, or one is markedly more effective, or if we fall behind, will Bronco break from his plan of every other series?

My bet is that once we get through FSU, that Jake excels against weaker opponents. Of course, Riley might as well. We really will need both against TCU and Utah.

bball wrote:
Because AF runs the option and practices everyday against running QBs, Nelson will not be able to run for much, and Nelson's passing is suspect.

I still don't understand this line of thought. Didn't UW practice every day against Locker? How good were they at stopping Nelson? It's a dangerous way to think, especially since this week all AFA is going to practice against is the scout team running BYU's offense.

Good point Sno. What would you say happens if BYU falls behind by two TD's, its 3rd quarter and Riley isnt as successful moving the ball? Do they go with jake to throw downfield? Particularly if he has been more successful moving the ball?

dmcougar wrote:
Good point Sno. What would you say happens if BYU falls behind by two TD's, its 3rd quarter and Riley isnt as successful moving the ball? Do they go with jake to throw downfield? Particularly if he has been more successful moving the ball?

I'm all about going with momentum in that scenario. We all have bad days, and we all have good days. In that situation, you ride the guy with the good day going and tell the kid with the bad day, "it happens to us all, better luck next week."