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Day 1 QB Battle

by SpiffCoug · 8/8/2010

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SpiffCoug
Heaps: 8/13, 114 yds, 2 TDs, 0 int, 185.97 rating

Nelson: 5/8, 49 yds, 0 int; 113.95 rating; 2 rushes, 13 yds, TD (and led another series to a TD).



So both led two series to touchdown, but Jake was MUCH more effective throwing. I think I stated in another thread that if Riley starts fall camp like he started spring camp - and that being slowly and not throwing well - that he may not have a chance to get going, because I think the coaches are looking to make a decision. And days like today start to point towards Heaps.



It is day one, but if I were Riley, I'd be taking tomorrow to figure out what I need to do on Monday to recover some lost ground. Leading two TD drives is good, but he must throw the ball better.
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Metallicat
Were you able to go to the practice.
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Ddawg
Love the post. This really means something now .... the cow's eating the cabbage!

Us Coug faithful love the scoop! Thx!!!!

8)
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Mars
kitic77 wrote:
Heaps: 8/13, 114 yds, 2 TDs, 0 int, 185.97 rating

Nelson: 5/8, 49 yds, 0 int; 113.95 rating; 2 rushes, 13 yds, TD
So basically it was just like Spring camp. :whistle:



What about Larks and Munns? Did you read these stats somewhere online?
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StatsCougar
Mars wrote:
Heaps: 8/13, 114 yds, 2 TDs, 0 int, 185.97 rating

Nelson: 5/8, 49 yds, 0 int; 113.95 rating; 2 rushes, 13 yds, TD
So basically it was just like Spring camp. :whistle:



What about Larks and Munns? Did you read these stats somewhere online?


Lark was 0/1 and no stats listed for Munns.
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jonnylingo
Unbelievable that jake can do that as a true freshman. Very impressive.



Sounds like both qbs did great. I don't know if those numbers matter. Both had two drives which lead to touchdowns. that's what matters.



So far its still even steven which I think helps heaps.



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fifthqb
So.. all the stuff bronco said about all 4 quarterbacks having an equal chance at the start of fall camp lasted until when? Doesn't look like anything close to a chance that Lark or Munns had. I'm disappointed.
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Italics
of all the stats from summer and thus far in fall camp, two things have really stuck out to me



1) Heaps yards-per-completion have been consistently much higher than Nelson's

2) Heaps has consistently had more touchdowns



If what little I've seen from Nelson is accurate - and if what I've heard has been accurate - Nelson is not the most accurate passer. Most of his passes seem to be smaller ones - screen passes and such. Just looking at the stats, I wouldn't be surprised for this to be the case. I'm going completely off of numbers and very little data here, but it's been interesting to note.

Heaps definitely seems to be more efficient in the long ball, as well as scoring touchdowns.
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Mars
Italics wrote:
of all the stats from summer and thus far in fall camp, two things have really stuck out to me



1) Heaps yards-per-completion have been consistently much higher than Nelson's

2) Heaps has consistently had more touchdowns



If what little I've seen from Nelson is accurate - and if what I've heard has been accurate - Nelson is not the most accurate passer. Most of his passes seem to be smaller ones - screen passes and such. Just looking at the stats, I wouldn't be surprised for this to be the case. I'm going completely off of numbers and very little data here, but it's been interesting to note. Heaps definitely seems to be more efficient in the long ball, as well as scoring touchdowns.

Nelson also threw a pick Day one. Coaches said he was "whistle sacked" as he was throwing. Since early practices have shells and not full pads, QBs aren't really allowed to be tackled or sacked. He still threw the ball into a defender's hands though.
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SpiffCoug
Mars wrote:
Nelson also threw a pick Day one. Coaches said he was "whistle sacked" as he was throwing. Since early practices have shells and not full pads, QBs aren't really allowed to be tackled or sacked. He still threw the ball into a defender's hands though.

Nelson did not throw an interception. The play was called back due a penalty. We can't count stats that don't count. Sorry Mars, I know you want to, just like you want to count the "interception" against Wyoming last year. But they don't count.



Here's the updated stats after day 1 after reading all the reports.



Heaps: 8-13-0-114, 2 TDs, 185.97 rating. 2 TD drives, 1 FG drive.

Nelson: 5-8-0-49, 0 TDs, 113.95 rating; 2 rushes, 13 yards, 1 TD. 2 TD drives. 2 FG drives.



Here's my opinion of how the QB Battle is going after one day.

Passing edge: Heaps. Scoring edge: Nelson. QB Battle: Slight edge to Heaps. QB to start if UW was tomorrow: Heaps.
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Cougs_Rule
Kitic, I dont get how you give the scoring edge to Nelson. Am i missing something?

I have also seen sources say Nelson had 1 passing and 1 rushing TD--be nice to get that clairifed. Even so, with 2 passing TD's and a field goal, how does 14 (Nelson) to 17 (Heaps) look like a scoring edge for Nelson?
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Cougs_Rule
One more thing. Although I still think Heaps is the best choice by end of september, that choice wasn't to become active at least until Sept 4. If UW were tomorrow you have to give the start to Nelson. As in golf, often its not who has the best shots, it comes down to who has the fewest bad shots. I gotta believe that Riley would still have fewer bad shots tomorrow in a real-time game. Under duress each QB would go to his default or strength: Riley would bail out with running, which will eventually stall drives, but Jake might be more prone to chuck it and get picked--or run for his life and take a very mean LB to the forehead--like Beck did against USC. OUCH! That hit still hurts.
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SpiffCoug
dmcougar wrote:
Kitic, I dont get how you give the scoring edge to Nelson. Am i missing something?

I have also seen sources say Nelson had 1 passing and 1 rushing TD--be nice to get that clairifed. Even so, with 2 passing TD's and a field goal, how does 14 (Nelson) to 17 (Heaps) look like a scoring edge for Nelson?

http://www.sltrib.com/sltrib/blogs/byusports/50072109-65/team-heaps-nelson-pass.html.csp" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

I stand corrected. I thought Nelson had led a TD drive that was capped by a rushing TD, by another player. In re-reading, I'm wrong.



Nelson engineered three scoring drives: 1 TD, 2 FGs. Heaps engineered three scoring drives: 2TDs, 1 FG.
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Cougarbib
I read that one of the receivers had to do nearly a full turn in mid-air to make a circus catch for a 40+ yard TD from Heaps. That does not sound like accuracy to me. Both QBs moved the ball and led the team to scores. I would imagine that the coaches also called plays to look at cetain situations and try various things. They did not have them both run the same plays against the same defensive calls and defensive and offensive supporting cast. You don't have enough data to know who was going agains the 1s and who was going against the 2s and who had 1s or 2s helping them move the chains.



The coaches will sort this all out. But it sounds like we have two pretty decent QBs so far or a pretty porous defense.



I didn't see much tight end news in what I read iirc. DId anyone hear how they looked.



Bib
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QuarterbackU
Cougarbib2 wrote:
I read that one of the receivers had to do nearly a full turn around in the air ot make a circus catch for a 40+ yard TD from Heaps. That doesn ot sound like accuracy to me. Both QBs moved tghe ball an dled the team to scores. I would imagine tha the coaches also called plays ot look at cetain situations and try various things. THey did not have them both run the sam eplays against eh same defensive calls and defensive and offensive supporting cast. YOu don't have enough data to know who was going agains teh 1s and who was gong against the 2s and who had 1s or 2s helping them ove the chains.



The coaches will sort this all out. But it sounds like we have two pretty decent QBs so far or a pretty porous defense.



I didn't see much tight end news in what I read iirc. DId anyone hear how they looked.



Bib


It doesn't matter if the reciever made an adjustment while the ball was in the air, what matters is that the reciever had a chance to make the catch because the ball went there. It looks like Nelson is checking down alot to get his completions. 5 of 8 is not bad at all but 49 yards is not a lot of passing yards. Let's see if Nelson can take some shots and be successful next week. You miss 100% of the shots you don't take right and that's what Nelson is doing. He's not even attempting the long passes.
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Cougarbib
Not every play is designed to throw long. You just do not have enough data to know if coaches called a play designed for a long throw and Nelson checked off from it, even though it was open, and took off running or dumped off short. The coaches may be calling plays to evaluate Nelson's short game. They may be calling quite different plays to evaluate Heaps long game. They may be focused on testing the defense for varying situations and using he different strength's of Neslon and Heaps to do so. I don't know. I wasn't there and the coaches didn't tell me what they were calling and expecting. But, having manged several large organizations, I can assure you that the coaches have a plan to look at certain things and to develop certain players in certain ways andit is not all focused on the QB.



As a side note - one of the O/L recently told friends of mine that his best guess is that Nelson will be the starter at UW. Not that he has any way of knowing - I merely point this out as reference to the fact that the jury is still out and both players have a legitimate shot in the eyes of their teammates.



I do wonder, as others above did, how will they evaluate Lark and Munns? Maybe they need to get 2 stadiums going with teams scrimmaging at both ends of both fields with 4 deeps because almost everyone on the team needs more experience.



I did read a Bronco quote that sounds like he expects a lot of the inexperienced players to conribute in 2010 - more so than normal. Hopefully, no O/L go early to the NFL and all of this inexperience will become experienced adding to some retention of our current experienced players and 2011 and beyond could be sweet - except for that stupid game coming up at Texas.
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SpiffCoug
Would anyone trade either of BYU's QBs for any other starting QB in the MWC? I don't think I would. I'd take Heaps and Nelson over Wynn, Carter-Samuels, Dalton, Jefferson and whomever leads SDSU, CSU, UNLV, and UNM to the dismal seasons they're going to have.
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Lawboy
Nelson also had a fumble on a center snap. But for Day 1, not reading too much into it. Guys are usually jacked up and jittery. Bronco himself said execution was back seat to effort in Day 1, as expected. I will read more into stats come week 2. That's when people have settled down and we will really be able to notice tendencies and see the separation.
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Mars


Nelson ran the full negative gamut on Day One. Threw an interception to Brian Logan (no penalty on the play). Got sacked. Had a pass batted down. Fumbled the ball. Didn't throw a touchdown pass.



Meanwhile, Heaps threw two touchdown passes, didn't throw an interception, didn't fumble, and threw for over twice as many yards.



Boys, the QB battle is over. Like many people have been saying all summer, Nelson is no Heaps.



Also, Lark is clearly viewed as 3rd string, and Munns as 4th string right now. They will get an equal chance if they earn it, but that are not currently all tied at the top like was previously suggested.
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