BYU's Academic Fact Sheet

scott715 wrote:
My understanding is that both Accounting programs had been #2 for a long time and just this year moved to #1 in the country. Once again the knock is no Phd program. But most of the tax competitions they win or take second place for a number of years.



PS I am an Accounting Masters Alum.

scott715 wrote:
My understanding is that both Accounting programs had been #2 for a long time and just this year moved to #1 in the country. Once again the knock is no Phd program. But most of the tax competitions they win or take second place for a number of years.



PS I am an Accounting Masters Alum.

Linette Chambers wrote:
And this is why my son goes there! Very AMAZING!!!

Linette Chambers

Dcr36 wrote:
Assuming that this is what you were alluding to:



US News and World Report Undergraduate Program Rankings:



Stanford: #4

Cal: #21

UCLA: #24

USC: #26

Washington: #42

Arizona: #96

WSU: #106

Oregon: #115

ASU: #121

Oregon State University: "Third Tier" (generally means "not ranked")



Compared to:



BYU: #71

Colorado: #77

Utah: #127



Disclaimer: recognize that this is merely a ranking of the undergraduate programs, which means that production of research and quality of grad programs (two areas where BYU is relatively weaker) aren't taken into consideration.



Also, before anyone gets too gloaty over BYU's ranking: there's a lot of "up-and-down" that every school on the list experiences outside the top 50 or so. BYU was 73rd when I started there in 2004; when I came home from my mission we were like 113th. Basically, this demonstrates that we are "on the same level" (with the undergrad program) as Oregon, Arizona, Utah, Colorado, etc.



I like the USNWR's rankings in general; I (as well as a lot of people) put more interest into them then I probably should have when I picked a law school. They have quite a bit of influence. You can read about their methodology, and criticisms of the system, here:



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/U.S._News_%26_World_Report#America.27s_Best_Colleges



And a few personal observations:



- Could someone explain to me why the quality of research institutions would matter to an athletic conference? I'm sure there's a good explanation, but it would seem to me that as the vast majority of college athletes are undergrads, the primary concern of the conference would be that the undergraduates are being well-educated. Do the exercise science departments of universities work together with the other schools in their athletic conferences?



- BYU is weak on research, admittedly, but the argument that this is because BYU is at odds with the rest of the college world* always struck me as a bit of a canard. (Anyone who has taken Biology 100 at BYU knows that, while the school aims at being faith-promoting, it certainly doesn't infringe on the traditional nature of the curriculum to same level as, say, Liberty University or Oral Roberts U.) My father-in-law teaches at the Y, and his basic assessment is:



1. BYU doesn't like taking money from the government. It has a strong history of trying to be independent as possible, and this influences its financial operations. Unfortunately, if you're not privy to outside influence from public institutions, this means you miss out on the vast majority of research funding.

2. BYU, by design, is more focused on educating undergrads than it is in doing research or providing graduate education, some notable exceptions notwithstanding. BYU's mission statement, as Mars quoted, is to "assist individuals in their quest for perfection and eternal life." That leads to a more student-focused (as opposed to faculty-focused) university.

3. There is, however, something of a sea change occurring, and BYU can hope to improve in the research department throughout the upcoming years. (I don't know if that's just my father-in-law's perpetual optimism, however.)



- I could go on, but I'll stop. I'm tired of hearing BYU getting slandered so much (not so much by editorialists, as much as in the comments sections) as a result of all the expansion chatter. I went to BYU, I currently go to Utah. At the end of the day, what happened in the classrooms at both schools was, for the most part, pretty comparable.



Sorry, Mars, if this betrayed the original intent of this thread. :whistle:



(*Academically speaking, of course. Culturally, we're definitely different.)

cougarsunited wrote:
Take away these two criteria and BYU is (at least close) to being a 1st tier university.

Mars wrote:

Take away these two criteria and BYU is (at least close) to being a 1st tier university.

BYU at #71 IS 1st Tier. Tier 1 even extends down through Arizona State at #121. There is no 2nd tier, like there used to be 10 years ago. After Tier 1 comes Tier 3, where Oregon State, Texas Tech, SDSU and the like reside. Then Tier 4 (UNLV), then Master's Universities (like Fresno State).

cougarsunited wrote:

Assuming that this is what you were alluding to:



US News and World Report Undergraduate Program Rankings:



Stanford: #4

Cal: #21

UCLA: #24

USC: #26

Washington: #42

Arizona: #96

WSU: #106

Oregon: #115

ASU: #121

Oregon State University: "Third Tier" (generally means "not ranked")



Compared to:



BYU: #71

Colorado: #77

Utah: #127



Disclaimer: recognize that this is merely a ranking of the undergraduate programs, which means that production of research and quality of grad programs (two areas where BYU is relatively weaker) aren't taken into consideration.



Also, before anyone gets too gloaty over BYU's ranking: there's a lot of "up-and-down" that every school on the list experiences outside the top 50 or so. BYU was 73rd when I started there in 2004; when I came home from my mission we were like 113th. Basically, this demonstrates that we are "on the same level" (with the undergrad program) as Oregon, Arizona, Utah, Colorado, etc.



I like the USNWR's rankings in general; I (as well as a lot of people) put more interest into them then I probably should have when I picked a law school. They have quite a bit of influence. You can read about their methodology, and criticisms of the system, here:



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/U.S._News_%26_World_Report#America.27s_Best_Colleges



And a few personal observations:



- Could someone explain to me why the quality of research institutions would matter to an athletic conference? I'm sure there's a good explanation, but it would seem to me that as the vast majority of college athletes are undergrads, the primary concern of the conference would be that the undergraduates are being well-educated. Do the exercise science departments of universities work together with the other schools in their athletic conferences?



- BYU is weak on research, admittedly, but the argument that this is because BYU is at odds with the rest of the college world* always struck me as a bit of a canard. (Anyone who has taken Biology 100 at BYU knows that, while the school aims at being faith-promoting, it certainly doesn't infringe on the traditional nature of the curriculum to same level as, say, Liberty University or Oral Roberts U.) My father-in-law teaches at the Y, and his basic assessment is:



1. BYU doesn't like taking money from the government. It has a strong history of trying to be independent as possible, and this influences its financial operations. Unfortunately, if you're not privy to outside influence from public institutions, this means you miss out on the vast majority of research funding.

2. BYU, by design, is more focused on educating undergrads than it is in doing research or providing graduate education, some notable exceptions notwithstanding. BYU's mission statement, as Mars quoted, is to "assist individuals in their quest for perfection and eternal life." That leads to a more student-focused (as opposed to faculty-focused) university.

3. There is, however, something of a sea change occurring, and BYU can hope to improve in the research department throughout the upcoming years. (I don't know if that's just my father-in-law's perpetual optimism, however.)



- I could go on, but I'll stop. I'm tired of hearing BYU getting slandered so much (not so much by editorialists, as much as in the comments sections) as a result of all the expansion chatter. I went to BYU, I currently go to Utah. At the end of the day, what happened in the classrooms at both schools was, for the most part, pretty comparable.



Sorry, Mars, if this betrayed the original intent of this thread. :whistle:



(*Academically speaking, of course. Culturally, we're definitely different.)

You couldn't be any more wrong, a 73 ranking is not representative of the quality of BYU as an academic institution. Many factors go into ranking a University, based on academic rigor alone, BYU would be TONS higher. There are two aspects that keep BYU relatively low:



1. Alumni/ student financial contribution to the University; this is a very important consideration for those that rank schools. Considering the subsidized tuition, raters aren't impressed by the level of alumni and students giving back.



2. Four year graduation rate; BYU does not look very good in this arena (Utah sucks here). A extremely large percentage of BYU students leave the University after one year to serve two year Missions while still being registered. The ranking body does not consider that students leave for Missions.



Take away these two criteria and BYU is (at least close) to being a 1st tier university. subsidize