Given our great history, why are we so epically bad against really good teams?

Some evidence of this is provided in this link here:



https://www.cougarboard.com/board/message.html?id=21216058



We are top 25 in overall win pct over the last 20 years. Tied for 35th in AP top 25 finishes over the last 20 years. Yet, out of the top 40 programs over the last 20 years we are 39th in win pct. over 10 win teams.



I also follow Arizona who is tied with the 75th best record over the last 20 years with lowly Wake Forest. Arizona is even better than us with a 9-48 record against 10 win teams. Wake Forest is 2-36 .053 win pct. (Yea! We're better than Wake Forest!)



Why are we so bad? Side note: why is Boise so good?



Record of the top 40 programs by winning pct. from 1999-2018 vs. FBS teams that won 10 games or more (does not include forfeited wins through NCAA violations):



Boise St. 22-12 .647

Ohio St. 33-23 .589

Oklahoma 36-30 .545

USC 28-28 .500

Alabama 31-33 .484

LSU 28-37 .430

Clemson 24-32 .429

Oregon 21-34 .382

Georgia 19-32 .373

Texas 22-39 .361

Florida St. 19-34 .358

Florida 25-46 .352

Iowa 17-32 .347

Miami 18-37 .327

Michigan St. 18-38 .321

TCU 12-27 .307

Auburn 21-48 .304

Stanford 17-40 .298

Notre Dame 17-41 .293

Michigan 18-45 .286

Georgia Tech 13-36 .265

Wisconsin 13-37 .260

Virginia Tech 11-32 .256

Oklahoma St. 15-44 .254

Northern Illinois 8-24 .250

Utah 10-30 .250

Tennessee 17-52 .246

West Virginia 11-35 .239

Texas A&M 15-48 .238

Louisville 9-31 .225

Toledo 6-24 .200

Penn St. 11-46 .193

Kansas St. 10-43 .189

Texas Tech 9-48 .158

Boston College 7-38 .156

Nebraska 8-44 .153

Cincinnati 5-31 .139

Fresno St. 5-37 .119

BYU 4-38 .095

Marshall 2-29 .065

I'll bite: There are probably multiple reasons. BSU strikes me as having the knack at playing clutch and being underestimated (at least historically); we play too tight in those games too often. That said, I think we'd need to know who these ten win teams are--in other words how do the ten win teams played stack up against the ten win teams BSU played....My feeling is there might be a difference? For example, in 2017, BSU beat Fresno State and SDSU, both ten win teams. But they aren't ten win teams the same way UW or Wisconsin are ten win teams....Also, This is saying BYU played 42 ten win teams in 19 years? And BSU played 34? I have a hard time remembering THAT many ten win teams played by either school.....

Two telling things from that list:



1) BYU sucks at it.

2) Only 4 teams are better than .500

snoscythe wrote:

Two telling things from that list:



1) BYU sucks at it.

2) Only 4 teams are better than .500

Actually, only three teams are better than .500 ;)

BoiseBYU wrote:

I'll bite: There are probably multiple reasons. BSU strikes me as having the knack at playing clutch and being underestimated (at least historically); we play too tight in those games too often. That said, I think we'd need to know who these ten win teams are--in other words how do the ten win teams played stack up against the ten win teams BSU played....My feeling is there might be a difference? Also, This is saying BYU played 42 ten win teams in 19 years? And BSU played 34? I have a hard time remembering THAT many ten win teams played by either school.....

Here's Boise:



Wins:



11-3 Fresno St. 2001

10-4 Hawaii 2002

11-2 TCU 2003

10-4 Oregon St. 2006

11-3 Hawaii 2006

11-3 Oklahoma 2006

10-3 Oregon 2008

10-3 Oregon 2009

12-1 TCU 2009

11-3 Virginia Tech 2010

10-4 Hawaii 2010

10-3 Utah 2010

10-4 Georgia 2011

10-3 Colorado St. 2014

10-4 Utah St. 2014

10-4 Arizona 2014

11-2 Troy 2017

10-3 San Diego St. 2017

10-4 Fresno St. 2017

10-3 Troy 2018

12-2 Fresno St. 2018

11-2 Utah St. 2018



Losses:



10-2 Washington St. 2001

11-1 Louisville 2004

10-3 Georgia 2005

12-1 Hawaii 2007

11-2 TCU 2008

13-1 Nevada 2010

11-2 TCU 2011

11-2 Fresno St. 2013

10-3 Air Force 2014

10-3 Air Force 2016

10-4 Fresno St. 2017

12-2 Fresno St. 2018

BoiseBYU wrote:

I'll bite: There are probably multiple reasons. BSU strikes me as having the knack at playing clutch and being underestimated (at least historically); we play too tight in those games too often. That said, I think we'd need to know who these ten win teams are--in other words how do the ten win teams played stack up against the ten win teams BSU played....My feeling is there might be a difference? For example, in 2017, BSU beat Fresno State and SDSU, both ten win teams. But they aren't ten win teams the same way UW or Wisconsin are ten win teams....Also, This is saying BYU played 42 ten win teams in 19 years? And BSU played 34? I have a hard time remembering THAT many ten win teams played by either school.....

Here's BYU:



Wins

11-2 Utah St. 2012

10-3 Utah 2009

11-2 TCU 2006

10-4 Hawaii 2002



Losses



10-4 Washington 2018

11-2 Utah St. 2018

10-3 Boise St. 2018

13-1 Wisconsin 2017

11-3 Boise St. 2017

10-4 Fresno St. 2017

10-3 West Virginia 2016

10-3 Boise St. 2016

10-3 Michigan 2015

10-3 Utah 2015

10-4 Utah St. 2014

12-2 Boise St. 2014

10-3 Memphis 2014

11-2 Boise St. 2012

12-1 Notre Dame 2012

11-2 San Jose St. 2012

11-2 TCU 2011

10-4 Florida St. 2010

13-1 Nevada 2010

13-0 TCU 2010

10-3 Utah 2010

12-1 TCU 2009

11-2 TCU 2008

13-0 Utah 2008

10-4 Tulsa 2007

10-3 Boston College 2006

11-1 TCU 2005

13-0 USC 2004

11-1 Boise St. 2004

12-0 Utah 2004

12-1 USC 2003

13-1 Boise St. 2003

10-2 Utah 2003

10-4 Colorado St. 2002

11-2 Louisville 2001

11-2 Florida St. 2000

10-2 Colorado St. 2000

13-0 Marshall 1999

So BYU has never beaten a 10-win BCS team. What's the best BCS team BYU has ever beaten? I'm guessing Wisconsin was right up there.

BYU has largely been a big fish in a small pond, beating up on teams in the WAC and MWC while beating few teams of substance. I think the "success" has gone to our head. Look how long it's been since we beat Utah. Meanwhile, BSU plays with a chip in their shoulder and despite beating teams of substance isn't content and still feels the need to prove themselves.



Oh...and recruiting, HC, and high academic standards. Did I cover all the excuses?

Mars wrote:

So BYU has never beaten a 10-win BCS team. What's the best BCS team BYU has ever beaten? I'm guessing Wisconsin was right up there.

‘90 Miami won 10 games

‘97 ASU and ‘96 KSU won 9

‘80 SMU, ‘81 Washington St, ‘88 Colorado, ‘89 Oregon, ‘09 Oklahoma, ‘13 Texas, and ‘18 Wisconsin all won 8 games



UCLA won 7 games in ‘83 but won the PAC 10