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BYU now 4th place in WCC

by hawkwing · 1/18/2015

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Guest
After a hard fought loss without 2 starters, and losing Mr Triple-Double for most if a half with foul problems the Cougars are now firmly in control of 4th place in the WCC.



The cougars desparately need to win out in WCC play (excluding Gonzaga) to get back up into the top 2 for a better seed in the WCC tourney.
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mendyman
This game had that feeling where things would get really ugly really fast but BYU kept fighting and had a chance. I surprised it stayed that close getting 2pts/2boards from our bigs :sick:
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Mars


Feels like we've officially dropped down into NIT territory.
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KYCoug
SM pretty much put on a clinic on how to beat a 4 guard team. We kept it close but too little too late. NIT here we come!
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byucougar1
Not so fast on the assessment. Winder did not play in that game, and the team missed his 15 points and tough D/rebounding. When Austin returns, there will be an additional 8-9 boards/game. Add to the fact that Kyle was plagued by foul trouble and his ability to distribute the ball and you have a great recipe for a loss. Better to evaluate this team when at full strength than throw in the towel. Being able to have 2 post players on the floor at once will help with the rebounding and take some of the burden off of KC. Look for improved play with their return to the lineup.



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BroncoBot
losses are adding up. unfortunately, the only time we are able to assess this team at full strength will be in the NIT. definitely a down year for bball at byu. surprised that byu hasn't been able to contend in the wcc as I still think that the mwc is overall a stronger conference year to year and byu nearly always was at the top of the conference standings.
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nuk13
[quote="byucougar1"]Not so fast on the assessment. Winder did not play in that game, and the team missed his 15 points and tough D/rebounding. When Austin returns, there will be an additional 8-9 boards/game. Add to the fact that Kyle was plagued by foul trouble and his ability to distribute the ball and you have a great recipe for a loss. Better to evaluate this team when at full strength than throw in the towel. Being able to have 2 post players on the floor at once will help with the rebounding and take some of the burden off of KC. Look for improved play with their return to the lineup.



I agree. Obviously the losses hurt but there are still a lot of games to play and, as you point out, Austin and Winder make a big difference. The last half of the season will depend a lot on their return and how well they play and work back into the team.
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scott715
I'm not conceding NIT yet. We should get several wins in a row now assuming we get Winder back.
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Sammich
I'm not totally sure that the MWC was a stronger conference for in-conference games. Of course the MWC regularly had teams ranked higher and had more respect, but that doesn't matter if in the actual games the teams are tough to beat. Even the bottom teams in the WCC come to compete; I'm not sure if BYU has had more than one blowout win since joining the conference. I think this is the reason why I don't like being in the WCC that much---they're a good conference but we don't get much credit for beating them and we are really punished for losing to them. BYU could have a year like this in the MWC and still have a good chance at the NCAA tournament.



The opposing fans are always offended when BYU complains about being in the WCC because they think they deserve more credit for how tough they are. They definitely do deserve more credit, but the fact that they don't get it is the problem.
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Brayden Green
Well, we are a blown out Collinsworth knee away from being dead last in the WCC, so I am pretty happy at being 4th at this point. Kyle is the only consistently good thing about BYU basketball right now. Hopefully Rose and the boys can get it together and develop everyone not named Haws or Collinsworth into an auto-bid run. Because, realistically, we are already on the bubble, outside looking in. One more loss, even to Zaga or SMU will lock that squarely into place. And a loss to anyone else is a dead lock to not getting in.
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Guest
BlueIsBetter wrote:
Well, we are a blown out Collinsworth knee away from being dead last in the WCC, so I am pretty happy at being 4th at this point. Kyle is the only consistently good thing about BYU basketball right now. Hopefully Rose and the boys can get it together and develop everyone not named Haws or Collinsworth into an auto-bid run. Because, realistically, we are already on the bubble, outside looking in. One more loss, even to Zaga or SMU will lock that squarely into place. And a loss to anyone else is a dead lock to not getting in.


I think Haw's is a pretty consistently good thing for BYU.
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SpiffCoug
I don't get all the hand-wringing. Everyone thought we were a bubble team coming into the season and we've done nothing to change that assessment one way or the other.



We knew BYU was a thin team - especially down low. Nothing has changed one way or the other.



We knew BYU was going to live and die by the three. Nothing has changed one way or the other.



We knew BYU couldn't afford many injuries in the backcourt. Nothing has changed one way or the other.



So far this year has played out as most have expected. And given the injuries to Austin and Winder, it's surprising BYU was even in the game against St. Marys.
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AmmonCougar1
SpiffCoug wrote:
I don't get all the hand-wringing. Everyone thought we were a bubble team coming into the season and we've done nothing to change that assessment one way or the other.



We knew BYU was a thin team - especially down low. Nothing has changed one way or the other.



We knew BYU was going to live and die by the three. Nothing has changed one way or the other.



We knew BYU couldn't afford many injuries in the backcourt. Nothing has changed one way or the other.



So far this year has played out as most have expected. And given the injuries to Austin and Winder, it's surprising BYU was even in the game against St. Marys.

First I would add to your last point, in addition to the injuries also the foul trouble and time missed from the game by Collinsworth.



But in response to your post I think many of us, myself included thought we could have made some early season statements similar to those in wins over Stanford and UMass (name teams whether good or not) We were in it and coulda shoulda beat a ranked SDSU and utah. We coulda should beat Purdue. At the time we thought Pepperdine should have been a walk in the park and despite the aforementioned injuries and foul problems we were still in it with St. Mary's if we even had half of those woulda couldas we would, in my opinion, been off the bubble and looking like a lock if we just finished 2nd in regular season and conference tourney to a very good Gonzaga team. Instead we won none of those key games and are looking destined for the NIT.



Go Cougs!!!

J. Child

Ammon, ID
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Gunk
Spot on, Spiff.



I didn't have high expectations for this season. We're still in it too. The season isn't over and even if we bottom out the rest of the regular season we still have a chance of making the NCAAs by winning the WCC tournament.



We knew post play would be an issue for us going into the season, so there shouldn't be any surprise there.



BYU is pretty much a Top 50 program year and year out. Occasionally we'll dip below and occasionally we'll spike above, but for the most part that's where BYU is.
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Brayden Green
hawkwing wrote:
Well, we are a blown out Collinsworth knee away from being dead last in the WCC, so I am pretty happy at being 4th at this point. Kyle is the only consistently good thing about BYU basketball right now. Hopefully Rose and the boys can get it together and develop everyone not named Haws or Collinsworth into an auto-bid run. Because, realistically, we are already on the bubble, outside looking in. One more loss, even to Zaga or SMU will lock that squarely into place. And a loss to anyone else is a dead lock to not getting in.


I think Haw's is a pretty consistently good thing for BYU.


Sure is.
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BroncoBot
AmmonCougar1 wrote:
I don't get all the hand-wringing. Everyone thought we were a bubble team coming into the season and we've done nothing to change that assessment one way or the other.



We knew BYU was a thin team - especially down low. Nothing has changed one way or the other.



We knew BYU was going to live and die by the three. Nothing has changed one way or the other.



We knew BYU couldn't afford many injuries in the backcourt. Nothing has changed one way or the other.



So far this year has played out as most have expected. And given the injuries to Austin and Winder, it's surprising BYU was even in the game against St. Marys.

First I would add to your last point, in addition to the injuries also the foul trouble and time missed from the game by Collinsworth.



But in response to your post I think many of us, myself included thought we could have made some early season statements similar to those in wins over Stanford and UMass (name teams whether good or not) We were in it and coulda shoulda beat a ranked SDSU and utah. We coulda should beat Purdue. At the time we thought Pepperdine should have been a walk in the park and despite the aforementioned injuries and foul problems we were still in it with St. Mary's if we even had half of those woulda couldas we would, in my opinion, been off the bubble and looking like a lock if we just finished 2nd in regular season and conference tourney to a very good Gonzaga team. Instead we won none of those key games and are looking destined for the NIT.



Go Cougs!!!

J. Child

Ammon, ID

Truth is, BYU is basically a bubble team every year except for those rare Jimmer/Davies teams. BYU has not risen to the occasion as they have in the past. They've beaten down the bad teams and provided moral victories against the better teams they've played. In the past they've generated enough excitement/upsets of other teams that they've been in the mix of teams to get into the NCAA tourney. I just don't think it will happen this year.



As highlighted by Spiff... oh well. We knew this wasn't going to be the greatest team, but they sure had some great chances to make a statement.
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Mars
scott715 wrote:
I'm not conceding NIT yet. We should get several wins in a row now assuming we get Winder back.

BYU's RPI was about 30 when we lost to Pepperdine at home, which dropped us down to 55. But losing at St. Mary's has raised us up to 49.



BYU can't really afford to lose any remaining games besides those against Gonzaga if the NCAA Tourny dream is to stay alive.





As for the MWC, it had its good days. Jimmer's senior year I think the conference was #3 in RPI. This year it is #12. The WCC is #9. But all the national pundits really notice are the Zags/Aztecs, ranked teams.
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BroncoBot
Mars wrote:
But all the national pundits really notice are the Zags/Aztecs, ranked teams. [/color]

Don't forget the utes at #12. :sick:
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SpiffCoug
BroncoBot wrote:

As highlighted by Spiff... oh well. We knew this wasn't going to be the greatest team, but they sure had some great chances to make a statement.

This is the frustrating part for me. BYU was so close to making those statements. A made shot by Haws and we beat Purdue. A missed call on a mugging on Haws and he's going to the FT line vs SDSU for the win. A better rebounding effort vs Gonzaga and Utah and St. Mary's and we could have pulled those out as well.



As you said... oh well.
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