It Begins--Northwestern FB Players File w/ NLRB to Unionize

snoscythe wrote:

I think that if they get paid they should be taxed on their scholarship to as that is part of their wages.

Problem is, once you start paying the athletes, college athletics as we know them are over with. Once you start paying them, not only do they have to start paying taxes, the school has to start withholding and paying employment taxes, and then they get the left-given right to unionize (which they will), and once they unionize they start striking and demanding more and more and more until they're just another professional league.

And so it begins:



http://espn.go.com/espn/otl/story/_/id/10363430/outside-lines-northwestern-wildcats-football-players-trying-join-labor-union" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;



They just jumped past the first step of getting paid more and went straight to unionizing.



An "overwhelming majority" of Northwestern football players have formally begun the process of unionizing. A rep from the National College Football Players Association filed paperwork with the NLRB and the players now have union cards on file at the NLRB and purport to be under the aegis of the United Steelworkers.



So now the NLRB gets to decide whether or not college football players are employees. If it decides they are and approves the union at NW, it's game over for college football as Northwestern will have to enter into collective bargaining with the United Steelworkers.



Things are a changin' !!!

I'll miss college football. Better enjoy it while you can, because if this keeps going we wont be watching a BYU team in the near future.

hawkwing wrote:
I'll miss college football. Better enjoy it while you can, because if this keeps going we wont be watching a BYU team in the near future.

We'll still have BYU football. What reason do you have for thinking otherwise?



One good outcome of this is it will make title IX irrelevant.

jvquarterback wrote:

I'll miss college football. Better enjoy it while you can, because if this keeps going we wont be watching a BYU team in the near future.

We'll still have BYU football. What reason do you have for thinking otherwise?



One good outcome of this is it will make title IX irrelevant.

I can 100% guarantee you that if college football goes to unionized football players there will not be a team fielded by BYU.

hawkwing wrote:

hawkwing wrote:
I'll miss college football. Better enjoy it while you can, because if this keeps going we wont be watching a BYU team in the near future.

We'll still have BYU football. What reason do you have for thinking otherwise?



One good outcome of this is it will make title IX irrelevant.

I can 100% guarantee you that if college football goes to unionized football players there will not be a team fielded by BYU.

I'm tempted to agree. There's no way BYU/Q12 stands for that, I also think that this will kill all but the very biggest of college football programs. Given the attitude of most Utahns toward unions, I don't the UoU or USU would be fielding teams either. I don't know how Northwestern may be different from most of the SEC/B12 schools which are located in right-to-work states, but if you look at the states that have both top-notch NCAA FB teams AND no right-to-work laws on the books, the list looks like this:

-California

-Oregon

-Washington

-Wisconsin

-Ohio

-Pennsylvania



If it came down to right-to-work, you'd only have 10 teams left from last year's top 25:

-Stanford (5)

-Ohio St (7)

-Missouri(8)

-Oregon(10)

-UCLA(17)

-Louisville(18)

-Wisconsin(19)

-Freson St (20)

-North. Ill. (23)

-USC(25)



Given the status of most state budgets right now I don't the the public universities would have any chance at all and I can't imagine the private ones doing any differently.



That said, I'm actually ok with it. NCAA FB is very exploitative and frankly I'm glad that the "student" athletes are finally getting a voice. I say go back to intramurals and make the NFL pay for its own minor league.

Northwestern might play better using scabs anyway.



More seriously, NW, iirc, has a very strong Jewish heritage and I would guess that there have been some very capable lawyers consulting with these players.



If college football can go pro - why not high school football?



Pop Warner union?



This all disgusts me. I quit watching professional football. I watch college football. Student athletes. I don't even bother to watch the semi pro teams like Florida and Alabama anymore.



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I must be getting old because the world is really starting to get on my nerves. :angry:

jonnylingo wrote:
I must be getting old because the world is really starting to get on my nerves. :angry:

Get off my lawn.

hawkwing wrote:

hawkwing wrote:
I'll miss college football. Better enjoy it while you can, because if this keeps going we wont be watching a BYU team in the near future.

We'll still have BYU football. What reason do you have for thinking otherwise?



One good outcome of this is it will make title IX irrelevant.

I can 100% guarantee you that if college football goes to unionized football players there will not be a team fielded by BYU.

Why do you say that? Why would it be any different than paying coaches?



Also the schools in the right to work states would be at an advantage as they wouldn't have to deal exclusively with the unions and could contract individually with the players based on production. I think you'd see a superior on field product for teams where you get paid what you're worth rather than what a socialist union negotiates. It would be a huge advantage for the Utah and Arizona schools over the rest of the PAC teams. Unions breed complacency and you would see it very quickly on the field.

Shocking that a team that plays in Chicago would be the first to unionize.

Sigh.



Just let the athletes make some money outside of their sport. A school doesn't have to "pay" their athletes. That can all be taken care of with outside sources. If JD Falslev wants to be a pitchman for Karl Malone Toyota while he is playing for BYU in order to pay off his student loans that he accrued when he was not on scholarship, he should be allowed to do so. His earning potential for endorsements will be higher at BYU than at any other time in his life. Let him take advantage of that as long as he remains a student in good standing with the University.

Only time I ever heard my grandfather swear was in reference to unions.



IMO, the players are shooting themselves in the foot here. Schools will simply stop fielding football teams. Top programs that are making 10s of millions a year may be able to patronize a union, but either way there will be fewer football programs. Competition for spots on football teams will skyrocket. There won't be enough spots for all the players. Only the elite will get to play and only at elite programs.



The players that get in the programs will be the ones that have been playing football their entire lives and their parents were able to afford it plus all the special coaching and training. Kids with talent form less affluent areas won't be getting those degrees that they otherwise would have received.



I get that the players are frustrated, their school makes millions from their work. But unionizing is the wrong answer.



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mormonrasta wrote:
Sigh.



Just let the athletes make some money outside of their sport. A school doesn't have to "pay" their athletes. That can all be taken care of with outside sources. If JD Falslev wants to be a pitchman for Karl Malone Toyota while he is playing for BYU in order to pay off his student loans that he accrued when he was not on scholarship, he should be allowed to do so. His earning potential for endorsements will be higher at BYU than at any other time in his life. Let him take advantage of that as long as he remains a student in good standing with the University.

I've never understood the no endorsement rule.



If I was a famous actor and was in the school production I'd still be able to do endoresements, etc.



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Gunk wrote:
Only time I ever heard my grandfather swear was in reference to unions.



IMO, the players are shooting themselves in the foot here. Schools will simply stop fielding football teams. Top programs that are making 10s of millions a year may be able to patronize a union, but either way there will be fewer football programs. Competition for spots on football teams will skyrocket. There won't be enough spots for all the players. Only the elite will get to play and only at elite programs.



The players that get in the programs will be the ones that have been playing football their entire lives and their parents were able to afford it plus all the special coaching and training. Kids with talent form less affluent areas won't be getting those degrees that they otherwise would have received.



I get that the players are frustrated, their school makes millions from their work. But unionizing is the wrong answer.

My favorite Union BS



This screw needs tightened - get me a screw driver

No - only the Screw Tightener I is allowed to tighten screws

Please. Urgent. And I know how to tighten a screw. I am not busy.

No.

OK - get the screw tightened to come over

No - it is his day off

This is urgent

OK - but we need to pay double time with a minimum 4 hours



Seniority vs performance is my 2nd favorite



We just need to get people in India to play the games - televise them - wear our uniform - we watch.



Name the heavily unionize industry where the US is competitive in this global eonomy.



and just what will the NCAA do in its quest to create any semblance of parity.



Maybe NCAA can contract for all of the players and assign them to teams.



When amateur athletics goes pro - I am out - I go fishing instead.



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Cougarbib wrote:
When amateur athletics goes pro - I am out - I go fishing instead.



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Ditto. I watch because I have an affiliation with the school. If BYU doesn't field a team, I'm pretty sure I will be done with college football. Maybe the world IS ending. :munch:

jvquarterback wrote:

I'll miss college football. Better enjoy it while you can, because if this keeps going we wont be watching a BYU team in the near future.

We'll still have BYU football. What reason do you have for thinking otherwise?



One good outcome of this is it will make title IX irrelevant.

Ironically, title IX may prevent this from happening, as funds to pay student athletes would not be equal, which would run afoul of the law.



Another thing that may happen is changing of how Division IA football is organized. There might be a unionized division verses anon-unionized division as the unions might not want to play non-union folks.



If this holds up in court, which I don't think it should as the students are not employees nor should they be, this will be a sad day indeed as many students that were getting into good colleges will no longer be able to as budgets will cut scholarships and other athletic programs, if not the football program at smaller schools, to afford to athletic departments open.



http://college-football.si.com/2014/01/28/northwestern-football-kain-colter-labor-union/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Should be noted that if this gets cleared, which I have no reason to doubt it will given the make-up of the NLRB, this isn't just the end of NCAA football as we know it, it's the end of college athletics outside of intramurals for anyone other than those schools flush with cash. Other players in other sports will join the movement, and once a precedent is set, all hell breaks loose as suddenly not just NW football players, but all collegiate athletes are viewed by the NLRB as employees. Title IX as written would be a death-knell alone--equal benefits have to be provided men and women, which is even worse than the NBA paying the WNBA's shortfalls.



Even then I don't know how long those schools flush with cash will be able to keep it moving. Part of what makes college football so widely loved is that it is widely played. More likely is that the NFL and NBA slowly move to a MLB model where they run their own developmental leagues to handle players coming out of high school, and those minor leagues replace NCAA football and hoops with something that is just a shadow of what it once was.

If they are employees, it will open a can of worms. Workmans compensation. Social Security on their scholarships. What about legal liability when a play gets in a fight when on the road? Lawsuits over rapes. The potential liability goes on and on.

StatsCougar wrote:



Ironically, title IX may prevent this from happening, as funds to pay student athletes would not be equal, which would run afoul of the law.

snoscythe wrote:
Title IX as written would be a death-knell alone--equal benefits have to be provided men and women, which is even worse than the NBA paying the WNBA's shortfalls.

Title IX is out the door if the kids are employees. Doesn't apply. Can't find the article I read saying this. I'll try to track it down.