Fan experience Basketball vs. Football

Comparing our Football and Basketball teams this year, including their records/opponents, skilled players, etc. I would say that they are very similar thus far into the basketball season.



But for some reason, I am much less critical of our basketball team and seem to enjoy their games 10x more. In thinking about this, I have come to the conclusion that this is due to the Basketball team providing a much more entertaining product without any doubt as to the players effort and the coaches desire to win.



Bottom line, I really enjoy watching the Basketball games and often find myself upset and shocked and bored watching the Football games.



In football, we play a bend don't break defense, with an "it's okay to lose as long as we don't lose by too much and lose in a noble way" mentality, with an execution first priority on offense. It is boring, it is predictable, and it drives most fans nuts to always play it safe, especially when the goal is to not lose by more instead of trying to win, even at a risk of losing by more.



In basketball, we attack, we run, we attempt some risky plays and we push. On defense we take chances, often giving up a few big dunks and offense rebounds, but also seem to create a lot of transition turnovers and seem to come up with more of the 50/50 lose ball plays. The team just seems to hustle and leave it all on the court.



In football, it seems like we always seem to be leaving something on the sideline and are left wondering "what if" and those "ifs" aren't really anything drastic.



Even in our basketball teams two loses, we fought, and we left it all on the court. You can't say that about our Football games vs ND and WI and Utah. I feel like the fans, the importance of winning, and the product matter to Rose, and not enough for Bronco.



I think our football coaches can learn a thing or two from our Basketball team (although the Basketball team definitely makes mistakes and can improve).

I agree with a few of your points. I feel like the basketball team and the football team have been strangely linked the last several years, both putting on nearly identical records and circumstances, and basketball has been very entertaining, while football has had its moments of frustrations.



I don't believe it's because the basketball team is trying harder than the football team, nor that the basketball coaches are coaching not to lose or any other such nonsense. I find it's because at the end of the day, I don't care nearly as much about basketball as I do football. It's a lot easier to take the loses and boneheaded play in stride because it doesn't matter to me nearly as much as loses and boneheaded plays in football do.

And it is easier to get into the NCAA tournament with a loss.

While it's no secret I do prefer hoops, I still watch every BYU football game, go to games anytime they play within reasonable driving distance and follow the team throughout the year. I would agree, the football team is struggling to keep fans interested.Here are my thoughts why:



1) Nothing to play for. Fans are realizing the odds of BYU winning out are few to none. Too many slogans and undelivering. There's no conference championship. Lose a game and we're headed to a no name bowl. Since the odds of winning out are so slim you can predict the outcome of the season before BYU football has played a down.

2) Defense is boring. For your average fan, watching a defensive battle is boring. It's like watching two pitchers duel in baseball. Unless you understand and appreciate good pitching, the game is boring. Bronco, relies on his defense, understandably ad it's a good defense. It doesn't make for "fun" games, though.

3) Quality wins. While it can certainly be said for basketball too, the football team hasn't gone in and beaten someone we weren't supposed to. We beat average teams and lose to good teams. Same with hoops, but the void seems longer with football.

4) 3 years too many. Football was embroiled in a QB controversy for three season. Didn't gain much ground with fans during that period.

5) High expectations. Football is the big dog. As a result, expectations are high. We keep failing to meet those expectations and fans become disinterested (see number 1). Basketball doesn't have as big a microscope so gets to enjoy playing with less pressure to succeed. Basketball does well, great. Falters, and it's "maybe next year."

6) Even the crappiest team has a chance. No matter how bad of a team you may be there is always a chance you string together 3 or 4 wins in a row at conference tournament time and go dancing. Not the case with football.

7) Rose's style is fun. Rose runs an entertaining brand of hoops. Even a couple of my coworkers enjoy watching a BYU bball game every now and then because they are so fun to watch.



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For most fans - Hawk nailed it. Even easier to take a loss by the men's soccer team.......wait - I don't think we have one.



For others, offense is fun and defense is less fun - maybe even boring.



A few BB fans may resent FB Big Dog status.



I like them both. I keep realistic expectations for both. I wish FB had a little mire fireworks on offense and I wish BB had a more respected defense.



Both fun to watch. FB actually, imho, has more recruiting constraints. I keep seeing schools with no football team, and no great conference affiliation in the top 20 and in the dance and able to compete. If lack of elite football conference affiliation does not hold them back - sheesh - why can't we ever beat our rivals Gonzaga and seldom beat Saint Marys. But everyone seems ok to be dominated by them every year.



Still fun to watch. Enjoy our teams. U could have much worse teams that U could be supporting.



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Gunk wrote:
While it's no secret I do prefer hoops, I still watch every BYU football game, go to games anytime they play within reasonable driving distance and follow the team throughout the year. I would agree, the football team is struggling to keep fans interested.Here are my thoughts why:



1) Nothing to play for. Fans are realizing the odds of BYU winning out are few to none. Too many slogans and undelivering. There's no conference championship. Lose a game and we're headed to a no name bowl. Since the odds of winning out are so slim you can predict the outcome of the season before BYU football has played a down.

2) Defense is boring. For your average fan, watching a defensive battle is boring. It's like watching two pitchers duel in baseball. Unless you understand and appreciate good pitching, the game is boring. Bronco, relies on his defense, understandably ad it's a good defense. It doesn't make for "fun" games, though.

3) Quality wins. While it can certainly be said for basketball too, the football team hasn't gone in and beaten someone we weren't supposed to. We beat average teams and lose to good teams. Same with hoops, but the void seems longer with football.

4) 3 years too many. Football was embroiled in a QB controversy for three season. Didn't gain much ground with fans during that period.

5) High expectations. Football is the big dog. As a result, expectations are high. We keep failing to meet those expectations and fans become disinterested (see number 1). Basketball doesn't have as big a microscope so gets to enjoy playing with less pressure to succeed. Basketball does well, great. Falters, and it's "maybe next year."

6) Even the crappiest team has a chance. No matter how bad of a team you may be there is always a chance you string together 3 or 4 wins in a row at conference tournament time and go dancing. Not the case with football.

7) Rose's style is fun. Rose runs an entertaining brand of hoops. Even a couple of my coworkers enjoy watching a BYU bball game every now and then because they are so fun to watch.



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I like bb at least as much as football. We have top athletes in Haws, Carlino, and Collinsworth. We have some freshmen that are doing very good things now and have bright futures.



!. I agree. I know there were a lot of complaints about the MWC but it did put us in position for a good bowl. I miss some of the old revelries.

2. Defense can be fun but not without a little better offense than we had thus far. You need both to make the whole game more fun.

3. Ya.

4. I got tired of complaints about Nelson. Heaps was just sorry.

5. Utah! I do have high expectations for the bb team, but I enjoyed the NIT last year which fulfilled a lot of my expectations.

7. Yup. Runs is a key word here.



.

Cougarbib wrote:

Still fun to watch. Enjoy our teams. U could have much worse teams that U could be supporting.



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Hawk, are we allowing this kind of language here? I think a public censure is in order.



However, Kinda interesting using the terms "much worse team" and "U" together.

Basketball is light years ahead of football, and the distance is only going to widen. Rose gameplans AGAINST the teams he is going to play (imagine that!) and when a gameplan isn't working, he changes it. He isn't perfect (playing Cusick a majority of minutes last year instead of Carlino and Calvert) but he maximizes talents, and steals victories were he sometimes shouldn't. I don't ever think that BYU doesn't have a chance. Especially this season. There have been football games that I just knew that we were going to lose or make close, all by sheer coaching mistakes. (Like, every Utah or TCU game that we have played for the last 5 years, for example).



Also, Rose doesn't start out by losing 66% of his games on a perennial basis. It helps to keep spirits high on a program when there is still something left to play for after the 3rd week. Rose makes it a habit to beat the in-state rivals, and because of that, we land the big in state talent.

BlueIsBetter wrote:
Basketball is light years ahead of football, and the distance is only going to widen. Rose gameplans AGAINST the teams he is going to play (imagine that!) and when a gameplan isn't working, he changes it. He isn't perfect (playing Cusick a majority of minutes last year instead of Carlino and Calvert) but he maximizes talents, and steals victories were he sometimes shouldn't. I don't ever think that BYU doesn't have a chance. Especially this season. There have been games that I just knew that we were going to lose or make close, all by sheer coaching mistakes.



Also, Rose doesn't start out by losing 66% of his games on a perennial basis. It helps to keep spirits high on a program when there is still something left to play for after the 3rd week.

You are onto something. Yes. BYU football should have opened up with 3 straight home games vs Weber State, Mount Saint Mary's, and who ever that team from Colorado Mesa was? Or Idaho and Idaho State. 3-0 start right there. But when BYU BB gets to about an 8-4 start here in another 2 weeks - what comparisons will you throw out then.



BYU basketball, at best, is on par with BYU football most years. This year - slightly better.



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College basketball is much easier to get into I agree but for only this reason...Everyone at the start of the season has a shot at the title, you can't say the samething about football..1 loss and its to some bowl vs a garbage PAC-12 teams...hard to get excited about that...I would still choose football if I could only watch one.

jacksonman wrote:
In football, we play a bend don't break defense, with an "it's okay to lose as long as we don't lose by too much and lose in a noble way" mentality, with an execution first priority on offense. It is boring, it is predictable, and it drives most fans nuts to always play it safe, especially when the goal is to not lose by more instead of trying to win, even at a risk of losing by more.

I think a lot of this is due to all the injuries before and during the season on the defensive side of the ball.

I would add that Rose is winning the recruiting battle more often than Bronco. Granted, a miss on Jabari, but he will be a one and done anyway.

But as has been stated, there are ALOT of similarities between these two teams. The GFGH approach has its upsides and downsides for both. Watching Carlino up chuck 3's is kind of like watching THill chuck passes early in the season.

But the biggest frustration for me is watching the Oline do poorly including false starts and holding, and other penalities and overall poor Red LightZone bungling similar to watching missed free throws. Red Light Zone and free throw. Ineptitude has cost wins and will çost more if not fixed.

BlueIsBetter wrote:
Basketball is light years ahead of football, and the distance is only going to widen. Rose gameplans AGAINST the teams he is going to play (imagine that!) and when a gameplan isn't working, he changes it. He isn't perfect (playing Cusick a majority of minutes last year instead of Carlino and Calvert) but he maximizes talents, and steals victories were he sometimes shouldn't. I don't ever think that BYU doesn't have a chance. Especially this season. There have been games that I just knew that we were going to lose or make close, all by sheer coaching mistakes.



Also, Rose doesn't start out by losing 66% of his games on a perennial basis. It helps to keep spirits high on a program when there is still something left to play for after the 3rd week.

+1



I don't see football getting any better over the next few years. Rather underwhelming.

I love both teams. I love both head coaches. I think both programs are at a pretty good level right now, but nowhere near elite.



If anything I'm more frustrated with basketball than football. We are in the top 20 ALL TIME in basketball wins. Yet, 74 teams have made it to the Elite 8 since we last made it there. We have 1 Sweet 16 in the last 30 years. 113 other schools have made it to at least one Sweet 16 in the last 30 years. Of course, no Final Fours.



Rose has never defeated a single digit seed in the NCAA tournament, never defeated a higher seed in the NCAA tournament, and never won a conference tournament. 49 current coaches have better NCAA tournament records than Rose (minimum 10 games coached).



People get frustrated because BSU and Utah have played in the BCS, and we haven't. That's fair. But Utah and Butler have played for CHAMPIONSHIPS in the last 15 years while we can't even sniff the Elite 8, so much as the Final Four, so much as the championship game. UGh.



Anyway, I don't mean to dwell on the negative. I like winning. Both coaches win at a rate that is as good as we have ever seen at BYU. That I am grateful for.

The NCAA Bball tournament is rigged for the high seeds, and if Davies didn't go full retard 2 years ago we could have **easily** gotten to the final four JImmers senior year.

BlueIsBetter wrote:
The NCAA Bball tournament is rigged for the high seeds, and if Davies didn't go full retard 2 years ago we could have **easily** gotten to the final four JImmers senior year.

Given our track record that's tough to say. Butler's style of play most closely resembled UCLA who beat us that year.

BlueIsBetter wrote:
The NCAA Bball tournament is rigged for the high seeds, and if Davies didn't go full retard 2 years ago we could have **easily** gotten to the final four JImmers senior year.

If if's and but's were candy and nuts...

Schmoe wrote:

The NCAA Bball tournament is rigged for the high seeds, and if Davies didn't go full retard 2 years ago we could have **easily** gotten to the final four JImmers senior year.

If if's and but's were candy and nuts...

Man, I am really fighting my inner child here... ;)

jacksonman wrote:

Even in our basketball teams two loses, we fought, and we left it all on the court. You can't say that about our Football games vs ND and WI and Utah. I feel like the fans, the importance of winning, and the product matter to Rose, and not enough for Bronco.



I think our football coaches can learn a thing or two from our Basketball team (although the Basketball team definitely makes mistakes and can improve).

:lol:

The only difference between basketball and football right now is the end of season perception--for hoops to leave a good taste in the fans mouth, all they have to do is win a game in the NCAA or win couple of games in some other post-season tournament.



For football, once the team hits two losses, the fans resign themselves to the same-old-same-old middle-tier bowl game.