Did Brandon Doman cost us a BCS game?

Random thought: If Taysom had a chance to finish out last season (barring the stupid injury)... would our offense have been good enough to be undefeated thus far?



Granted that's assuming we win out (big if) but does anyone believe that a more seasoned Taysom wouldn't have been enough to beat Virginia and Utah?

We would have won those games and will give Wis and ND all they can handle.

Good question. I guess it depends on a couple of things. Were Hill's early struggles a result of his lack of game experience or a lack of experience in the offensive system. Hill was more accurate last year than he was early on this year. However, I think any more experience, even in a different system, would have helped this year. May have even led to those wins.

Double wrote:
Good question. I guess it depends on a couple of things. Were Hill's early struggles a result of his lack of game experience or a lack of experience in the offensive system. Hill was more accurate last year than he was early on this year. However, I think any more experience, even in a different system, would have helped this year. May have even led to those wins.

It's a fun hypothetical question. Taysom obviously needed some games this year to get comfortable. Keep in mind, barring that injury he could have started the season without the brace too and not missed any spring summer or fall work. It's hard to believe he wouldn't have been good enough (i.e. better) to close the deal on Va and Utah.



Of course, the way he plays and played last year, he could have gotten hurt later and he can still get hurt this year...

craigoscarson wrote:
Random thought: If Taysom had a chance to finish out last season (barring the stupid injury)... would our offense have been good enough to be undefeated thus far?



Granted that's assuming we win out (big if) but does anyone believe that a more seasoned Taysom wouldn't have been enough to beat Virginia and Utah?

It is a fair question and the answer is maybe.



Still unclear whether that poor game and clock mgmt was on Doman or Bronco.



We would have beaten UVA and Utah and been undefeated going into Wisconsin. We probaby would not have been picked off 3 times vs Houston, either.



Then we would have to see if we could overcome - am I allowed to say this - giving home field advantage to Wisconsin and ND.



But it definitely cost us those 2 early losses and would have Hill going into Wisconsin and ND as a seasoned Vet.



Unless all the pounding Hill takes got him injured somewhere else down the line.



Maybe.



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craigoscarson wrote:

Good question. I guess it depends on a couple of things. Were Hill's early struggles a result of his lack of game experience or a lack of experience in the offensive system. Hill was more accurate last year than he was early on this year. However, I think any more experience, even in a different system, would have helped this year. May have even led to those wins.

It's a fun hypothetical question. Taysom obviously needed some games this year to get comfortable. Keep in mind, barring that injury he could have started the season without the brace too and not missed any spring summer or fall work. It's hard to believe he wouldn't have been good enough (i.e. better) to close the deal on Va and Utah.



Of course, the way he plays and played last year, he could have gotten hurt later and he can still get hurt this year...

Haha. I thought you were talking about last year's team!

I agree craigoscarson, if Hill had played more last year, I think the extra experience reading defenses would have led to wins over Utah and Va. BYU was right in those games even with the little experience he had.



On a side note, I am new to posting to this site. I have followed all of your posts for a few years and have really enjoyed reading all of your thoughts on BYU sports. For some reason, maybe the joy from beating BSU, I decided to register today. However, I don't know how to work the site completely. If someone doesn't mind helping me out...how do I respond to someone's specific post? Thanks

Double wrote:
I agree craigoscarson, if Hill had played more last year, I think the extra experience reading defenses would have led to wins over Utah and Va. BYU was right in those games even with the little experience he had.



On a side note, I am new to posting to this site. I have followed all of your posts for a few years and have really enjoyed reading all of your thoughts on BYU sports. For some reason, maybe the joy from beating BSU, I decided to register today. However, I don't know how to work the site completely. If someone doesn't mind helping me out...how do I respond to someone's specific post? Thanks

Hit that quote button like I just did. And welcome!

BoiseBYU wrote:

I agree craigoscarson, if Hill had played more last year, I think the extra experience reading defenses would have led to wins over Utah and Va. BYU was right in those games even with the little experience he had.



On a side note, I am new to posting to this site. I have followed all of your posts for a few years and have really enjoyed reading all of your thoughts on BYU sports. For some reason, maybe the joy from beating BSU, I decided to register today. However, I don't know how to work the site completely. If someone doesn't mind helping me out...how do I respond to someone's specific post? Thanks

Hit that quote button like I just did. And welcome!

Thanks! I was looking in the wrong spot.

Craig



One further thought and one that will probably bring out both Doman and Anae haters.



If Hill had just gone into Victory Formation and taken a knee. BYU would likely have won another game or 2 or 3. If they only won 1 more game and that game was SJSU, Doman would probably still have his job. Reynolds may or may not have retired. But Dupaix and Cahoon would still be here. Maybe even Weber. We would not have GFGH. We would not have Atuaia, 2J, or our new WR coach - Guy Holliday - all of whom seem to be doing well now.



So maybe the Anae and Doman supporters and Haters can comment on whether Hill getting injured cost us a BCS Bowl this year ir was a blessing in disguise, or Doman and not changing the scheme would have won UVA and Utah.



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Cougarbib wrote:
Craig



One further thought and one that will probably bring out both Doman and Anae haters.



If Hill had just gone into Victory Formation and taken a knee. BYU would likely have won another game or 2 or 3. If they only won 1 more game and that game was SJSU, Doman would probably still have his job. Reynolds may or may not have retired. But Dupaix and Cahoon would still be here. Maybe even Weber. We would not have GFGH. We would not have Atuaia, 2J, or our new WR coach - Guy Holliday - all of whom seem to be doing well now.



So maybe the Anae and Doman supporters and Haters can comment on whether Hill getting injured cost us a BCS Bowl this year ir was a blessing in disguise, or Doman and not changing the scheme would have won UVA and Utah.



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Most of my thoughts exactly. Not a direct correlation, but if Hill doesn't get hurt, Doman probably doesn't lose his job. So, answer, is most likely and most likely.

BD Most likely cost us a BCS bc if Hill doesn't get hurt, he improves and moves forward; but then, Doman keeps his job and so does Webber and whatever other problems existed. Oline is probably worse than last year (since 2J brought in some folks); and bc Doman stays, we have good (bc Hill is here) not great Offense this year.

But, back to reality, bc how could this hypothetical be played out with much accuracy, it culd be argued that if he didnt get hurt AND Doman leaves, Anae still struggles to get this offense humming until mid season as he predicted. I don't hate Anae, but he has at times constrained this O (UVA) by not implementing at least a few things, like--did he really wait until BSU to roll out the TE plays????? I mean c'mon!!! The TE package deployed vs Utah takes them down; likewise WRs catching the stinking ball would have given THill confidence not stress and more pressure and he settles in.

I hate to say wait till next year, but if Bronco can reload on D (most especially reload his LB studs and production) and the Oline can get some better bodies in, this team could be scary good next year with Heisman worthy candidate in THill, JW even bigger and better; solid WRs and one year with this scheme; and an easier schedule. Glasss half full, folks.

We lose some key players on lots of fronts.

Hoffman

Ridley iirc

Kicker

Falslev iirc

Several DL and LB



Probably good if the early schedule allows for that to Jell.



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scott715 wrote:
We would have won those games and will give Wis and ND all they can handle.

But it still won't be enough... Wisconsin is in the top 10 in the nation in both total offense and total defense and Notre Dame's D will be able to contain Hill and the offense while managing to score enough points to win the game. If BYU beats Wisconsin, then Hill needs to start being mentioned in the Heisman talks, that is how impressive it will be.

Wolfman wrote:

We would have won those games and will give Wis and ND all they can handle.

But it still won't be enough... Wisconsin is in the top 10 in the nation in both total offense and total defense and Notre Dame's D will be able to contain Hill and the offense while managing to score enough points to win the game. If BYU beats Wisconsin, then Hill needs to start being mentioned in the Heisman talks, that is how impressive it will be.

Bet the house on it right? Like you did the Texas game?

craigoscarson wrote:
Random thought: If Taysom had a chance to finish out last season (barring the stupid injury)... would our offense have been good enough to be undefeated thus far?



Granted that's assuming we win out (big if) but does anyone believe that a more seasoned Taysom wouldn't have been enough to beat Virginia and Utah?

I assume you took this from my comment in the other thread. So obviously, yes, I believe this wholeheartedly. Taysom missed not only a half dozen more starts (potentially) but also all of spring ball. That's an eternity in a 4-year college football career and was all due to stupid coaching. Sorry Doman, I can't let this one go. This was the year...

No. We don't blame norm chow for playing doman 11 plays in 1 999 at wife receiver instead of letting him red shirt. Otherwise we wouldn't have been stuck with lance Pendleton and Brett engemann at QB in 2002

Yes. I think a healthy Taysom is worth at least one extra TD in each of those games.

mizzoucoug wrote:

Random thought: If Taysom had a chance to finish out last season (barring the stupid injury)... would our offense have been good enough to be undefeated thus far?



Granted that's assuming we win out (big if) but does anyone believe that a more seasoned Taysom wouldn't have been enough to beat Virginia and Utah?

I assume you took this from my comment in the other thread. So obviously, yes, I believe this wholeheartedly. Taysom missed not only a half dozen more starts (potentially) but also all of spring ball. That's an eternity in a 4-year college football career and was all due to stupid coaching. Sorry Doman, I can't let this one go. This was the year...

No I rewatched the 2nd half of the Virginia game this morning and couldn't believe that #4 is the same guy. The made mention of his knee and knee brace but I just couldn't shake how much better Hill is.

I haven't been terribly critical of Doman, particularly because he never really had a QB, but these are the types of mistakes that you can't make.



Many of these coaches get paid better than surgeons, so why don't they pay attention and catch some of these excruciating details? They should be programmed to not even hesitate when those moments occur.



Anae blew it on the pass call. I don't care if the play was there or if it was a fluke it got intercepted.. the right call was run the ball (in the rain storm), punt to Virginia and let our defense win the game (in the rain storm). This is the 1st major criticism I've had of Anae since the day we lost to Utah and Harvey got the ball only about 1/3 of the amount he should have. I don't blame Anae for Utah this year, but I am now wondering if a more seasoned Hill would have made the passes he overthrew in those games. I don't dislike Anae and am glad he's back, but I didn't get it then and I don't get it now. (fyi don't rewatch the Virginia game unless you want to dry heave for an hour afterwards)



Doman blew it on a lot of plays,(I still forgive him some, he had a very young Heaps that wasn't or may never be ready and an undersized and oft injured Riley), but the little details like running the ball instead of taking a knee differentiate great coaches from high school coaches.



This entire thread is incredibly hypothetical (we can't replay those games and we certainly haven't beaten Wisconsin or Notre Dame)... but it's fun (and a little aggravating when you see yesterdays Hill and compare him to Virginias Hill)... night and day.

Keep moving forward. I haven't rewatched Virginia or utah and I won't. They are over and done with and both will be haunting losses at the end of this year but there is no reason reliving the pain.



Taysom's injury last year was on a stupid call but it was also a fluke injury. The odds that Taysom gets hit just right like he did are very low.

One other thought, I think that Hill's early struggles had more to do with horrible Oline play than his injury from the year before. He is still wearing the knee brace and it doesn't seem to be affecting his speed or mobility so that isn't the reason he looked bad at Virginia.