If you think Houston is a really good team...

mizzoucoug wrote:
Craigo, everything you're saying makes sense to me but I think you are not giving them enough credit. UofH has legit playmakers on offense and defense. The problem was that their strength (passing game) exposed our biggest weakness (DB's). That's why this game was a shootout. Teams with lockdown corners will probably slow them down better than us, but I don't see them losing 3 more games this season. I'll take that bet.

If you really believe that Houston is a good team (a couple posters have already mentioned 1984 and 1996 Cougars to compare Houston) then let's see who truly believes that and who is just geeked after the emotional win.



Anyone that wants a free lunch put your name here. If Houston loses l3 games or more, you buy me lunch. If Houston doesn't lose 3 or more games the rest of the season I'll buy you lunch (anywhere you want... Tucanos, Rodizio, you name it...).



Who really believes that Houston is a really good team and will lose no more than 2 games the rest of this season. If so... put your lunch where your mouth is. I personally believe that Houston will lose 3 games+ the rest of the way.



There's a reason that Vegas had us as double digit favorites on the road... we escaped a mediocre team with some talent, but they are hardly world beaters.

I'm probably geeked out since I was there and it was a crazy fun game to be at. I'll get back to this tomorrow and see how I feel.

A three loss Houston team IMO is still a good team. If you want to make the same bet at 6-6, I might bite. I only referenced 96 in order to make a point. I don't think this Houston team is as good as our cotton bowl team but the reason our cotton bowl team didn't get to a "bowl alliance" bowl is because everyone said "who have they beaten?" Our only loss was to a decent WA Huskies team so before we beat KSU, we essentially had beaten nobody. The Wyoming team we beat in the WAC championship game had only lost one game until they lost to us and they didn't get a bowl invite, that is how much the WAC was disrespected. Houston is a good team, we beat an undefeated team in their house who was very motivated to prove they were as good as their record.

I'll bite - of course if you win, you have to come to Des Moines to claim your prize! :P



No one used the 84 or the 96 teams to indicate that Houston was as good as those teams, but just to make the point that the argument about "who have they beaten?" doesn't hold water.

frdbtr wrote:
A three loss Houston team IMO is still a good team. If you want to make the same bet at 6-6, I might bite. I only referenced 96 in order to make a point. I don't think this Houston team is as good as our cotton bowl team but the reason our cotton bowl team didn't get to a "bowl alliance" bowl is because everyone said "who have they beaten?" Our only loss was to a decent WA Huskies team so before we beat KSU, we essentially had beaten nobody. The Wyoming team we beat in the WAC championship game had only lost one game until they lost to us and they didn't get a bowl invite, that is how much the WAC was disrespected. Houston is a good team, we beat an undefeated team in their house who was very motivated to prove they were as good as their record.

That would be a 4 loss Houston team. I'm saying they lose 3 more. I was at the Cotton Bowl and we were 15 yards away from losing that one too, to a #15 ranked Kstate team. We dominated Kstate statistically just like we dominated Houston statistically, and both came down to the last few plays of the game....except Kstate was good.

IowaCougar wrote:
I'll bite - of course if you win, you have to come to Des Moines to claim your prize! :P



No one used the 84 or the 96 teams to indicate that Houston was as good as those teams, but just to make the point that the argument about "who have they beaten?" doesn't hold water.

I will definitely go to Des Moines. My wife has team members from her business there and she wants to work with them anyhow.



As for me paying off, you don't have to come to Fresno. You win, I'll buy you a gift certificate to any place you want lunch. This is how sure I am that Houston will lose at least 3 more.

Tempting..... You wouldn't be getting much of a meal from me though if I lost. Maybe some Oklahoma Joe's?

This is just getting annoying. Since when does a team with a solid winning record not count as a good team? Why would 3 losses suddenly make them bad, especially when one of them is to us?

Sammich wrote:
This is just getting annoying. Since when does a team with a solid winning record not count as a good team? Why would 3 losses suddenly make them bad, especially when one of them is to us?

I think he's arguing that they will have 4 or more losses, which would put them in the mediocre category for me were it to happen with their upcoming schedule.

BroncoBot wrote:
Tempting..... You wouldn't be getting much of a meal from me though if I lost. Maybe some Oklahoma Joe's?

Oklahoma Joes is the best BBQ in the world..... That's one heck of a meal.

Sammich wrote:
This is just getting annoying. Since when does a team with a solid winning record not count as a good team? Why would 3 losses suddenly make them bad, especially when one of them is to us?

The only thing I find annoying is comparing the 84 national championship team to a team that has beaten RICE, TEMPLE, MEMPHIS, SOUTHERN (D1AA), AND UTSA ... and not in the most dominant style.



utsa #124 temple #143 rice #72 Memphis #102

http://www.usatoday.com/sports/ncaaf/sagarin/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;



In spite of their wins and record, they were #56 in the Sagarin..... middle of the road. Just playing us and losing probably improves that.



I didn't say Houston was bad, I just said they're not that great and that a 4 loss Houston team based on their schedule would qualify as mediocre.



Can you imagine if someone came out and said (right after we beat Texas), "Texas isn't as good as you all think. Be glad you won, but you didn't dominate a team that deserves a top 10 ranking." People would have been up in arms... and then Texas goes and proves that they're talented but not great.



Houston is not nearly as good as their record would make you think... and we beat them by 1 point. Let's not all act like we just won the super bowl. We beat the Sagarin ranked #56 team by 1 point. Glad we did, glad Taysom showed what he can do in the future. In fact I'm relieved we won, but no one is going to convince me that Houston is a really good team unless Houston goes out and beats a good team. The 84 national championship team beat good teams... bottom line

craigoscarson wrote:

This is just getting annoying. Since when does a team with a solid winning record not count as a good team? Why would 3 losses suddenly make them bad, especially when one of them is to us?

The only thing I find annoying is comparing the 84 national championship team to a team that has beaten RICE, TEMPLE, MEMPHIS, SOUTHERN (D1AA), AND UTSA ... and not in the most dominant style.



utsa #124 temple #143 rice #72 Memphis #102

http://www.usatoday.com/sports/ncaaf/sagarin/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;



In spite of their wins and record, they were #56 in the Sagarin..... middle of the road. Just playing us and losing probably improves that.



I didn't say Houston was bad, I just said they're not that great and that a 4 loss Houston team based on their schedule would qualify as mediocre.



Can you imagine if someone came out and said (right after we beat Texas), "Texas isn't as good as you all think. Be glad you won, but you didn't dominate a team that deserves a top 10 ranking." People would have been up in arms... and then Texas goes and proves that they're talented but not great.



Houston is not nearly as good as their record would make you think... and we beat them by 1 point. Let's not all act like we just won the super bowl. We beat the Sagarin ranked #56 team by 1 point. Glad we did, glad Taysom showed what he can do in the future. In fact I'm relieved we won, but no one is going to convince me that Houston is a really good team unless Houston goes out and beats a good team. The 84 national championship team beat good teams... bottom line

While on my mission to Washington, the Huskies fans took great pleasure in telling me that BYU didn't beat even one top 25 team in 84. No one has said that Houston is as good as BYU's 84 team or as good as BYU's 96 team. What we are saying is that a team that was formerly 5-0 is a good team. Yes, BYU should have won by a wider margin and if Taysom had thrown to Hine instead of Matthews in the back of the end zone, i think you would have seen BYU win by a wide margin but the fact is, Houston is a very scrappy team who threw everything at BYU in order to add legitimacy to their record and BYU still won, on the back of Taysom Hill.....despite his mistakes.

frdbtr wrote:

Sammich wrote:
This is just getting annoying. Since when does a team with a solid winning record not count as a good team? Why would 3 losses suddenly make them bad, especially when one of them is to us?

The only thing I find annoying is comparing the 84 national championship team to a team that has beaten RICE, TEMPLE, MEMPHIS, SOUTHERN (D1AA), AND UTSA ... and not in the most dominant style.



utsa #124 temple #143 rice #72 Memphis #102

http://www.usatoday.com/sports/ncaaf/sagarin/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;



In spite of their wins and record, they were #56 in the Sagarin..... middle of the road. Just playing us and losing probably improves that.



I didn't say Houston was bad, I just said they're not that great and that a 4 loss Houston team based on their schedule would qualify as mediocre.



Can you imagine if someone came out and said (right after we beat Texas), "Texas isn't as good as you all think. Be glad you won, but you didn't dominate a team that deserves a top 10 ranking." People would have been up in arms... and then Texas goes and proves that they're talented but not great.



Houston is not nearly as good as their record would make you think... and we beat them by 1 point. Let's not all act like we just won the super bowl. We beat the Sagarin ranked #56 team by 1 point. Glad we did, glad Taysom showed what he can do in the future. In fact I'm relieved we won, but no one is going to convince me that Houston is a really good team unless Houston goes out and beats a good team. The 84 national championship team beat good teams... bottom line

While on my mission to Washington, the Huskies fans took great pleasure in telling me that BYU didn't beat even one top 25 team in 84. No one has said that Houston is as good as BYU's 84 team or as good as BYU's 96 team. What we are saying is that a team that was formerly 5-0 is a good team. Yes, BYU should have won by a wider margin and if Taysom had thrown to Hine instead of Matthews in the back of the end zone, i think you would have seen BYU win by a wide margin but the fact is, Houston is a very scrappy team who threw everything at BYU in order to add legitimacy to their record and BYU still won, on the back of Taysom Hill.....despite his mistakes.

And if they lose 3+ more the rest of the way...? I believe they will. Glad we won, but BYU beat good teams in 1984. Houston hasn't beaten a team in the top 70

BTW I spent the majority of the post Utah State game stating that Utah State was a good team, while defending our Oline play in that game. I simply do not look at a teams record and decide if they're good. #1 I have to see them play #2 I want to see who they've already played and what the result was (time of possession, margin of victory, turnover margin, schedule of those that they played and those results, etc.)



I have no doubt that a Utah State team with a healthy Chuckie Keaton would beat Houston, yet we dominated USU (granted we injured Chuckie). We beat Houston by 1 point... a Houston that had a 2 pt conversion bounce off a receivers chest. The margin was razor thin.



People complained ad nauseum about our play against Utah State though we dominated them. We beat Houston by 1 point in the last minute of the game and somehow Taysom is now a Heisman trophy finalist in the minds of BYU fans. I get it... the adrenaline, the excitement.. the 5-0 record of Houston and of course getting the W. But my opinion doesn't change. Houston's record is smoke and mirrors. I expect them to lose 3 more.. if they do, then I'll believe I was correct. If they don't, I'll buy anyone here lunch that really wants to stake a claim to believing that Houston is a good team. If they lose 4 games with the schedule they have, I don't know how anyone can claim they're a good team. Nor does a #56 sagarin scream "quality team"

Well Sheesh Craig



At least remind us who they play the rest of the way.



Houston is a good team. They are not a great team. If they played our schedule this season - they probably would fare about like we did. Maybe worse. Probably worse. At least 1 point worse.



But they are dangerous enough to win some that they theoritically should not win.



Enjoy the win. Nailbiter. Fun. Ugly win. Lots of stars today.

craigoscarson wrote:
BTW I spent the majority of the post Utah State game stating that Utah State was a good team, while defending our Oline play in that game. I simply do not look at a teams record and decide if they're good. #1 I have to see them play #2 I want to see who they've already played and what the result was (time of possession, margin of victory, turnover margin, schedule of those that they played and those results, etc.)



I have no doubt that a Utah State team with a healthy Chuckie Keaton would beat Houston, yet we dominated USU (granted we injured Chuckie). We beat Houston by 1 point... a Houston that had a 2 pt conversion bounce off a receivers chest. The margin was razor thin.



People complained ad nauseum about our play against Utah State though we dominated them. We beat Houston by 1 point in the last minute of the game and somehow Taysom is now a Heisman trophy finalist in the minds of BYU fans. I get it... the adrenaline, the excitement.. the 5-0 record of Houston and of course getting the W. But my opinion doesn't change. Houston's record is smoke and mirrors. I expect them to lose 3 more.. if they do, then I'll believe I was correct. If they don't, I'll buy anyone here lunch that really wants to stake a claim to believing that Houston is a good team. If they lose 4 games with the schedule they have, I don't know how anyone can claim they're a good team. Nor does a #56 sagarin scream "quality team"

I was not one of those people who downplayed the USU game. That was a huge win. As far as BYU's offensive line, they played poorly against usu and every other team with the exception of Texas. I had higher hopes for the Oline this year because Anae is a very good Oline coach and was supposed to be helping coach them. Unfortunately, they are not playing well. I think they are getting better, but still playing really bad.

Cougarbib wrote:
Well Sheesh Craig



At least remind us who they play the rest of the way.



Houston is a good team. They are not a great team. If they played our schedule this season - they probably would fare about like we did. Maybe worse. Probably worse. At least 1 point worse.



But they are dangerous enough to win some that they theoritically should not win.



Enjoy the win. Nailbiter. Fun. Ugly win. Lots of stars today.

http://espn.go.com/college-football/team/_/id/248/houston-cougars" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;



They might not win another game until after Thanksgiving... what does starting with a 5-0 record against teams that average #100 or higher mean if they lose 3 more to what's left on their schedule?

That is a tough sched to finish the year. I could definitely see 3 more losses. BUT, they will be to good teams.

BroncoBot wrote:
That is a tough sched to finish the year. I could definitely see 3 more losses. BUT, they will be to good teams.

yep... and in order to be considered anything but mediocre.. you have to at least beat a couple good teams... we shall see. I think that Houston is going to get exposed and that our performance tonight was not really as spectacular as it may seem. It was fun and exciting and pumped we won, but I'm not about to claim that anyone has arrived or that Hill's performance was good enough to day to beat a top 15 team, because it wasn't.

craigoscarson wrote:

That is a tough sched to finish the year. I could definitely see 3 more losses. BUT, they will be to good teams.

yep... and in order to be considered anything but mediocre.. you have to at least beat a couple good teams... we shall see. I think that Houston is going to get exposed and that our performance tonight was not really as spectacular as it may seem. It was fun and exciting and pumped we won, but I'm not about to claim that anyone has arrived or that Hill's performance was good enough to day to beat a top 15 team, because it wasn't.

I think that's fair.



So you defended BYU after the USU win claiming it was against a good team, you downgrade the quality of the Houston win. How good exactly is this BYU team according to you?



Just interested.