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Man, We're a Desperate Bunch Here

by northerncougar · 9/24/2013

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northerncougar
We are so frustrated with what’s happening with this program that some are grasping at whatever they can to try to feel better. I understand the reaction. It’s painful to watch your team underperform. I just don’t get this weird response of ignoring reality.



Some strange arguments that some posters have made:

• Bronco is the same as Lavell and brought us back from the brink of disaster. I didn’t realize that getting back to where were in 1979 was what we were shooting for. Is status quo what we are hoping for?

• That too many seem to want a national championship and we should keep our expectations in check. I haven’t seen a single poster on here talk about winning a national championship. At least not expecting it to happen now. Of course our HC sure talks about it a lot.

• Telling people to give Hill some time. He will improve. I hope so. He can’t get worse. It’s not possible.

• My favorite is some genius brought Alabama into the argument. After reading it twice I still have no idea what the intent was. Saban has won three of the last four NC’s. I have no idea what that means for BYU. It is so out there it is laughable.



These are just some of the strange rationalizations for what is wrong with this program right now.



Here are the facts:

• We currently have the worst QB in college football. That’s amazingly embarrassing and pathetic. But it’s okay, because our OC keeps telling us to just give it time. It will be fine.

• This is the same OC that let Brad Sorensen leave the program. A QB who is now on an NFL roster. After 4 years of starting the wrong QB, including a 2nd string safety and a RB, it’s obvious that the offensive coaching staff doesn’t know how to evaluate talent.

• BYU is 3-6 against their rival. Losing 66% of the time to your rival will get you fired most places. Win just a couple of those games and things are quite different.

• It’s not like BYU is losing to a perennial Rose Bowl team in the rivalry game each year. They are losing to a team that didn’t make a bowl last year and likely won’t this year.

• BYU has started 1-2, 7 of the last 9 years. Even Lavell had at least one 3-0 start in his first 9.

• Bronco can’t figure out how to hire offensive coaches. 9 years of offensive underperformance is the reality. 4 straight years of offensive futility is inexcusable.



Until we face the reality that Bronco doesn’t know how to fix the offense, we will continue down this same painful road. I hope he can, but that is the reality. Face it or not is up to you.
J
jacksonman
Amen and AMEN!
I
IowaCougar
http://assets.amuniversal.com/d57ee0d0ecbb01300b5a001dd8b71c47" alt="" loading="lazy" style="max-width:100%">



I remain an optimist, but I am occasionally disappointed. :~(
Y
YNot
northerncougar wrote:
Here are the facts:

• We currently have the worst QB in college football. That’s amazingly embarrassing and pathetic. But it’s okay, because our OC keeps telling us to just give it time. It will be fine.


True that Hill is statistically the worst passing QB. But at the same time, BYU's offense is #24 in the nation right now (were you aware of this?) averaging just under 500 yards per game, including 440 yards against Utah. #8 in the nation in rushing yards. It's not as bad as you're trying to make it sound.


northerncougar wrote:

• This is the same OC that let Brad Sorensen leave the program. A QB who is now on an NFL roster. After 4 years of starting the wrong QB, including a 2nd string safety and a RB, it’s obvious that the offensive coaching staff doesn’t know how to evaluate talent.


Did you, or any other program in the nation see Brad Sorensen's NFL potential? No. Otherwise, he would not have ever played a down at Southern Utah.


northerncougar wrote:
• BYU is 3-6 against their rival. Losing 66% of the time to your rival will get you fired most places. Win just a couple of those games and things are quite different.



• It’s not like BYU is losing to a perennial Rose Bowl team in the rivalry game each year. They are losing to a team that didn’t make a bowl last year and likely won’t this year.


This is definitely a contributing factor. A glaring black-eye on BYU's recent seasons and Bronco's resume. But 8-5, 10-3, 7-6 over your last three seasons isn't exactly a doomsday scenario. I don't even know when BYU's last losing season was. I'm sure it was 2003 or 2004 under Crowton.


northerncougar wrote:
• BYU has started 1-2, 7 of the last 9 years. Even Lavell had at least one 3-0 start in his first 9.


So did Bronco. 2008. I'm sure glad they play the other 9 games every year! See 8-5, 10-3, 7-6, 11-2, 10-3.


northerncougar wrote:
• Bronco can’t figure out how to hire offensive coaches. 9 years of offensive underperformance is the reality. 4 straight years of offensive futility is inexcusable.


494 yards per game does not qualify as "offensive futility". I get the frustration, we're 1-2 again and have failed to get more than 16 points on the board in 2 of our 3 games. But BYU will be just fine this year. Again, I'm glad we play the other 9 games. Great games coming up in the next 5 weeks against Utah St., Georgia Tech, Houston (currently 3-0), and Boise St.



Wisconsin and Notre Dame in November. There is still a lot to cheer for over the next two months.
B
brpajense
We've had a ton of threads calling out players, saying coaches suck, that coaches need to be fired, that we need a new line and a new group of receivers, and that the program is a sinking ship and our head coach/OC/QB/receivers are the metaphorical leaks which can only be patched by firing people.



I have a lot more fun watching how things play out than making lists rehashing everything that went wrong especially when I can't change any of it.



Here's are typical reactions after the game:

• BYU wins by scoring a touchdown on the final play of the game? It's a great game and was fun to watch.

• BYU loses by a touchdown after throwing four passes into the end zone on the final series of the game? Get the cross and some nails because Jesus' blood doesn't wash away football sins and someone has to atone for the loss.


northerncougar wrote:
...I just don’t get this weird response of ignoring reality.



• My favorite is some genius brought Alabama into the argument. After reading it twice I still have no idea what the intent was. Saban has won three of the last four NC’s. I have no idea what that means for BYU. It is so out there it is laughable.


Nick Saban comes up because if we fire Bronco, we have to replace him with somebody.



Bronco has a 71% winning percentage as a head coach and there aren't many coaches with better records.

• Nick Saban's got a 74% winning percentage over his career.

• Urban Meyer has an 84% winning percentage.

• Gary Patterson has a 75% winning percentage.

• Bob Stoops has an 80% winning percentage.



Who do you think will come in and do a better job than the staff we've already got? The top tier coaches with the best chance to improve our record won't come here because we can't offer them the money or prestige they're after.



Look at Notre Dame after Lou Holtz retired--in the 13 years after Holtz retired they had three great seasons in 13 years until they hired Brian Kelly:

• Bob Davie's record was 35-25 (58%)

• Ty Willingham started off hot (10-3 his first season) but ended up with a 21-15 record (58%)

• Charlie Weis started with two good seasons (9-3 his first season, 10-3 his second) but ended up 35-27 at Notre Dame (56%)

Brian Kelly had been really successful at Cincinnati before he took over at ND in 2010. He started off with two 8-5 seasons at ND and before notching a 12-1 record and losing only in the national championship game.



Notre Dame was hiring top coaching talent from established programs but didn't pick many winners. Are we going to outdo them drawing from a smaller pool of coaching candidates?



We might get a good season here or there, but may spend 15-20 years burning through coaches and having a good season once every four or five years.
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D
Ddawg
IowaCougar wrote:
http://assets.amuniversal.com/d57ee0d0ecbb01300b5a001dd8b71c47" alt="" loading="lazy" style="max-width:100%">



I remain an optimist, but I am occasionally disappointed. :~(


+1. As challenging, and discouraging as it can be at times.
W
Wolfman
Texas' pathetic D has a lot to do with BYU being #24 in the nation in total offense right now, not to mention the GFGH style of offense, where you're running a lot more plays and thus, the increased ypg. But it's what you do in the red zone that matters and putting points on the board and BYU is struggling mightily in this area right now. 29 total points vs. Virginia and Utah ain't gonna cut it. That 600 yard, 40 point performance vs. Texas won't happen again this season except for possibly Middle Tennessee State and definitely Idaho State and and so the Cougs are going to have to figure out how to pass the ball with a QB who is more than erratic with his throws.
S
SpiffCoug
Wolfman wrote:
That 600 yard, 40 point performance vs. Texas won't happen again this season ...

And this includes all other Texas opponents. What BYU did against Texas was historic. It had NEVER been done by anyone against Texas.
M
Mars
YNot wrote:
BYU's offense is #24 in the nation right now (were you aware of this?) averaging just under 500 yards per game. It's not as bad as you're trying to make it sound.

Look at BYU's points-per-play and yards-per-play. It's ugly. Snapping the ball quickly to get more plays doesn't work if you are wasting the vast majority of them (quality>quantity).
S
SpiffCoug
Mars wrote:
BYU's offense is #24 in the nation right now (were you aware of this?) averaging just under 500 yards per game. It's not as bad as you're trying to make it sound.

Look at BYU's points-per-play and yards-per-play. It's ugly. Snapping the ball quickly to get more plays doesn't work if you are wasting the vast majority of them (quality>quantity).

BYU's yards per play biggest issue is due to a lack of pass completions.



BYU is averaging 5.3 yards per rush - that's pretty good.

BYU is averaging 14.1 yards per pass completion - that's pretty good too.



The problem is on 65% of our passes, we're averaging 0 yards. Start completing more passes and BYU will be ok on offense.



As a whole, we're averaging 5.2 yards per play.
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YNot
SpiffCoug wrote:
BYU is averaging 5.3 yards per rush - that's pretty good.

BYU is averaging 14.1 yards per pass completion - that's pretty good too.



The problem is on 65% of our passes, we're averaging 0 yards. Start completing more passes and BYU will be ok on offense.



As a whole, we're averaging 5.2 yards per play.


We just need to average 5.2 yards per play when we get into the red zone! (But, I am using that Rugby toss at my ward's Turkey Bowl this year...)
S
SpiffCoug
The double lateral will probably work well for the turkey bowl.
B
BoiseBYU
SpiffCoug wrote:
YNot wrote:
BYU's offense is #24 in the nation right now (were you aware of this?) averaging just under 500 yards per game. It's not as bad as you're trying to make it sound.

Look at BYU's points-per-play and yards-per-play. It's ugly. Snapping the ball quickly to get more plays doesn't work if you are wasting the vast majority of them (quality>quantity).

BYU's yards per play biggest issue is due to a lack of pass completions.



BYU is averaging 5.3 yards per rush - that's pretty good.

BYU is averaging 14.1 yards per pass completion - that's pretty good too.



The problem is on 65% of our passes, we're averaging 0 yards. Start completing more passes and BYU will be ok on offense.



As a whole, we're averaging 5.2 yards per play.


5.2 yard per play is outstanding, yes? What hurt with Utah is not completing the task....We had blue zone chances with nothing to show for it except a field goal....Obviously 35% completition ratio is not workable too, but like I said our offense was not too different than Utah's on many metrics. the one thing Utah did was convert their red zone opportunities. We did not....
W
Wolfman
SpiffCoug wrote:
That 600 yard, 40 point performance vs. Texas won't happen again this season ...

And this includes all other Texas opponents. What BYU did against Texas was historic. It had NEVER been done by anyone against Texas.

Good point, however, all the right elements came together for BYU to do that in that game... Texas was coming off a 49 point thrashing of NMSU, they were over-confident and thought all they had to do was show up and they'd win, their defensive Coordinator obviously hadn't prepared his D for what BYU was going to do, BYU was coming off a last second loss at Virginia, Texas was favored, BYU's O line had some major changes done to it after week 1, etc., etc., etc. Also Spiff, no BYU QB has ever been dead last in the nation in passing efficiency either.
G
Gunk
I could care less how many yards we get if it doesn't result in points on the board. Fine we hung 600 yards on Texas and got some TDs. Meanwhile, when it came time to score against VA and Utah we couldn't. We had more yards than Utah did, but they had more points. I'll trade points over yards any day.



That #24 is a very misleading stat, and serves to the point of this thread.
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801Coug
Wolfman wrote:
Wolfman wrote:
That 600 yard, 40 point performance vs. Texas won't happen again this season ...

And this includes all other Texas opponents. What BYU did against Texas was historic. It had NEVER been done by anyone against Texas.

Good point, however, all the right elements came together for BYU to do that in that game... Texas was coming off a 49 point thrashing of NMSU, they were over-confident and thought all they had to do was show up and they'd win, their defensive Coordinator obviously hadn't prepared his D for what BYU was going to do, BYU was coming off a last second loss at Virginia, Texas was favored, BYU's O line had some major changes done to it after week 1, etc., etc., etc. Also Spiff, no BYU QB has ever been dead last in the nation in passing efficiency either.

I unfortunately have to agree the Texas win did not showcase our strength as much as it exposed Texas and the problems with in that program. Looking back I feel the stars aligned for that win. We will see as we get further into the season. If had been able to duplicate or even come close to that performance against Utah I would feel differently.
W
Wolfman
Some interesting national rankings for BYU on the season so far:



http://www.cfbstats.com/2013/national/index.html



Scoring offense: 92

Rushing offense: 8

Passing offense: 98

Passing efficiency: 123

Total offense: 23

First downs: 21

3rd down conversions: 99

Red zone conversions: 47

Scoring defense: 40

Rushing defense: 40

Pass defense: 72

Total defense: 44

Strength of schedule: 30



By comparison, last year at this time, BYU was in the top 15 in total D. They've dropped 29 spots from last season. It's also quite interesting to note that the offense, as abysmal as it's been, is actually ranked 21 spots higher nationally than the D. Go figure.
S
SpiffCoug
I like my comparisons better. They look at how BYU is doing compared to what our opponents do on average while on offense and what they give up while on defense.



You can find those comparisons here:

http://www.cougarcorner.com/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=15499" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
N
NDCougar
Wolfman wrote:
Some interesting national rankings for BYU on the season so far:



http://www.cfbstats.com/2013/national/index.html



Scoring offense: 92

Rushing offense: 8

Passing offense: 98

Passing efficiency: 123

Total offense: 23

First downs: 21

3rd down conversions: 99

Red zone conversions: 47

Scoring defense: 40

Rushing defense: 40

Pass defense: 72

Total defense: 44

Strength of schedule: 30



By comparison, last year at this time, BYU was in the top 15 in total D. They've dropped 29 spots from last season. It's also quite interesting to note that the offense, as abysmal as it's been, is actually ranked 21 spots higher nationally than the D. Go figure.


The D's stats and ranking go down the more it is on the field. The speed they are playing causes the D to be on the field longer and GFGH is producing too many 3 and outs, thus the defense on the field for longer periods of time. I believe the D has played better than it ranking, although if we play a good passing team a few holes will be exposed.
S
SpiffCoug
The D is playing very well. They've held our opponents on average 119 yards below their average rushing yards. 135 yards below their total yardage, and 16 yard below their passing yardage and 19 point below scoring average. All while facing more plays than opponents run on average.
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