Any experience with Kahr?

Looking for a CCW for the wife, and I really like the size, weight, ballstics, and especially the price on the CW9, but I'm not terribly familiar with the brand.



Anyone have any insight on Kahr for me?

I have never owned or shot a Kahr. Below is a review of a Kahr that is pretty favorable.



That said - I must disclose an extreme bias. I am not an automatic pistol guy for backup, or CCW (concealed) purposes. I am a pretty hardcore revolver guy for CCW.



Why? Revolvers work and are safe.

#1 Issue is safety. With almost all accidental pistol shootings, it is almost a given that it involves a semi-auto pistol. Semi-auto's use safeties - sometimes complex multiple safeties that in a real world situation could defeat your wife from actually using the gun to defend herself successfully (against the scumbag).



Revolvers have no complex safeties. The double action trigger, and the effort to cock the hammer are the safeties. Mongo like. Simple, effective. Easy to just pull the trigger at 2 am when your groggy and half asleep.



P.S. You'll see that in the Kahr review, that particular pistol does not have a safety. I don't know if all Kahr's are built like that. For quick deployment that's great. But, for the wife to carry (probably in her purse), and being around kids. A semi-auto not having a safety could be problematic.





#2 Jamming. Semi-autos can be finicky about their diet. As you read the article on the Kahr, or any semi-auto, they pay particular attention to what ammo they "like", and ammo that they don't digest well and jam up. You'll read that the Kahr in the below link liked everything but Wolf ammo.



I will say, that during my 7 years with the LACo Sheriff Dept., we carried S&W revolvers until the last year, and transitioned to semi-auto 9 mm's. My revolver never jammed. Every time I went to the range to practice, someone with a semi-auto had a jam on the firing line.



If it was me Sno, I would look to pick up a used 5 shot detective type revolver. Either a S&W, Ruger, or Taurus in .38. The .38 has the same ballistics as the 9 mm. Revolvers are bomb proof - and safe.



Remember - 2 to the body - 1 to the head. :D



http://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/2012/04/eric-nelson/gun-review-kahr-pm9-initial-impressions/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

I have a pocket Kahr 380. It's a great little gun and gets carried often.



My wife prefers the 38/357 S&W J-frame revolver for her carry.

Here's the link to look at the S&W J frame Detective type revolvers.



http://www.smith-wesson.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/Category4_750001_750051_757768_-1_757767_757751_image" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

If there is a conversation on guns I have to weigh in.



I too am helping my wife prepare to choose a CCW weapon. I have only heard good things about the Kahr so we went and test fired one along with some other handguns. At Get Some guns and ammo in Orem you can rent and test fire every handgun they have for $20. I highly recommend that you and your wife do the same.



I believe it is very important that ultimately your wife choose her own carry weapon.



Though I do not disagree with anything that Ddawg has said (everyone is going to have personal preferences and specific needs.) I lean away from a revolver around kids. The things are either loaded or unloaded. They are no good unloaded and nothing to prevent a kid from pulling the trigger when they are. Even double action is scary because very small children can push on the trigger with their thumbs. Sure guns should never be so accessible but stuff happens.



Though an autoloader is more complex, they provide one or two quick steps from unloaded to fire and small kids can't pull back a slide. My argument is that if a person is not going to be serious enough to be proficient with a weapon then they may not be disciplined enough either.



As far as I am concerned the safest, fastest, simplest handgun ever made is the HK P7. Good luck finding one though and if you do it will cost you a small fortune.



One subcompact that I really like is the Beretta Nano. I think it is better than the Glock.

Ddawg--I hear you on the revolvers. My only issue with them is they don't work well as an inside-the-waistband gun with the bulge. Hence we're looking at the narrow single-stack 9mms for a CCW gun (it will also double as something I can take cycling).



As for safeties, I refuse to buy a handgun with a safety. They tend to be too complicated and too error prone, and my personal feeling is that a safety acheives nothing common sense and diligence can't acheive, and safeties can lead to complacency and mis-placed reliance.

Sno: After what you have described as your desired specs for a CCW, you really should check out the Nano. The dimensions of the Nano and Kahr CM9 are almost identical. The Nano is actually a little thinner because not only does it not have a safety but it doesn't have an external slide release either. It is slick sided and snag free.



It is made in America and Cabela's is advertising them on sale for $399.



Here's a link, http://www.berettanano.com/

snoscythe wrote:
Ddawg--I hear you on the revolvers. My only issue with them is they don't work well as an inside-the-waistband gun with the bulge. Hence we're looking at the narrow single-stack 9mms for a CCW gun (it will also double as something I can take cycling).



As for safeties, I refuse to buy a handgun with a safety. They tend to be too complicated and too error prone, and my personal feeling is that a safety acheives nothing common sense and diligence can't acheive, and safeties can lead to complacency and mis-placed reliance.

Sno-Dawg, I agree with you - every point you made. I know I am coming across anti-semi-auto pistol. I am not. I own several (1 Glock and 1 H&K) and love them. My point is if it's for the wife - semi-auto's can be a problem for all the reasons I listed. Yes, women are just as smart as a guy, and they can train and become just as proficient with a gun as a guy. But most don't.



Gun skills are a time depreciating skill. To be skilled, smooth, fairly quick, and error free - you need to practice - repeatedly - for years. Most women, after a few trips to the range, the say: "Ok, I got it." And they move on feeling comfortable.



My standard is - when something goes wrong and you need a gun, it will probably be 1. Dark, 2. Up close and personal, 3. Fast and violent.



I read an article about 15 years ago on the average "conditions" around a shooting in the typical "victim vs. bad guy." The average shooting situation happens when it is: 1. Dark, 2. Within 10 ft., 3. Actual shooting takes 3-4 seconds. So, you (or your wife) must perform in a life threatening situation when it's dark, probably tired, it's close, quick, and violent. No second chances. You win, or you don't go home.



Those are my thoughts. I know, I'm a bore. Remember - 2 to the body, and 1 to the head.

tww wrote:
Sno: After what you have described as your desired specs for a CCW, you really should check out the Nano. The dimensions of the Nano and Kahr CM9 are almost identical. The Nano is actually a little thinner because not only does it not have a safety but it doesn't have an external slide release either. It is slick sided and snag free.



It is made in America and Cabela's is advertising them on sale for $399.



Here's a link, http://www.berettanano.com/

You know off hand if they sell extended (slightly extended, not the phallic looking 20/50/100 rd mags) for the nano? My issue would be the height. I'm a big guy (6'5") with some long hands and fingers, so one thing I liked about the Kahr was that extra bit of height. To be honest, I'd prefer the M&P Shield where it's 4.7" and it comes with an extended mag that stretches it to just over 4.9", but we gave up a long time ago on finding one of those in stock under $600. The Kahr is 4.5" with the added length of the non-flush mag, but the Nano, is, well, "nano" at 4.2". Unless I had an extended mag to give me a bit more on the grip, the Nano would be a "wife-only" gun, which she would probably be okay with. The "micro" compacts just tend to get lost in my palms. If I can add some length to it, I could be very comfortable with the Nano.

snoscythe wrote:

Sno: After what you have described as your desired specs for a CCW, you really should check out the Nano. The dimensions of the Nano and Kahr CM9 are almost identical. The Nano is actually a little thinner because not only does it not have a safety but it doesn't have an external slide release either. It is slick sided and snag free.



It is made in America and Cabela's is advertising them on sale for $399.



Here's a link, http://www.berettanano.com/

You know off hand if they sell extended (slightly extended, not the phallic looking 20/50/100 rd mags) for the nano? My issue would be the height. I'm a big guy (6'5") with some long hands and fingers, so one thing I liked about the Kahr was that extra bit of height. To be honest, I'd prefer the M&P Shield where it's 4.7" and it comes with an extended mag that stretches it to just over 4.9", but we gave up a long time ago on finding one of those in stock under $600. The Kahr is 4.5" with the added length of the non-flush mag, but the Nano, is, well, "nano" at 4.2". Unless I had an extended mag to give me a bit more on the grip, the Nano would be a "wife-only" gun, which she would probably be okay with. The "micro" compacts just tend to get lost in my palms. If I can add some length to it, I could be very comfortable with the Nano.

Yeah, I hear ya. Beretta does have an 8 round mag that gives a little more to hang onto but not much. My understanding is that they are developing some other options with the grip but I have no idea when they will be available. One of their selling points is that when they do come out with other stuff, the lower portion of the gun is totally swappable because the serial number is on the inner chassis.



That is one of the nice things about the Glock 26. There are enough add-ons available that you can make it whatever length you want.



My wife is currently leaning toward the Walther PPQ. I like it too and even though it is bigger it is still small and light enough to carry in most situations.



I have a friend that worked with Jeff Cooper back in the day and now he teaches a CCW course. He tries to talk his students into carrying full size or close to it.



It just goes back to the old saying, "The best gun is the one you have with you." The bigger the gun the better until it is too big to have with you.



Like everything else, there is no one tool that does it all. Decide the one or two needs in a gun that are most important for you and start there. Eventually you will have a complete collection and it won't matter.



It sounds like Ddawg feels most comfortable with his revolver. For me it is my P7. You will find what feels right for you. Hopefully your wife can make it fit into her lifestyle.



Good luck

Hey Sno-Dawg, I know this is a bit late ..... but. (Ya gotta remember, Mongo is slow).



I have been looking & looking. I found an article from the summer of 2012 (not too dated). In it, an author rates what he feels are the 5 best "Carry Concealed Handguns."



Well - one of his recommended handguns is Kahr PM9. He says it is extremely reliable, accurate, and user friendly. Here's the link.



http://www.ammoland.com/2012/06/top-5-concealed-carry-handguns/#axzz2NL845Hx6" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

I just found this video of Ddawg demonstrating how to use a revolver, which explains why he likes revolvers better then auto-loaders. Auto loaders are just so dang slow. Mongo not slow!



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lLk1v5bSFPw

For SAFE to FAST natural instinctive to shooting, and sexy to boot nothing beats this. They should never have stopped making them.



http://www.worldaffairsboard.com/attachments/small-arms-personal-weapons/18891d1266522295-any-hk-fans-10-5k-spare-hk_nickel_p7m8.jpg" alt="" loading="lazy" style="max-width:100%">

Very nice. Mongo would say - "Dayumn!" 8)

http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=330703697" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;



This one's going to eclipse $2K if I had to bet on it.

tww wrote:
I just found this video of Ddawg demonstrating how to use a revolver, which explains why he likes revolvers better then auto-loaders. Auto loaders are just so dang slow. Mongo not slow!



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lLk1v5bSFPw

Excellent. Funny post. It's true that with practice - repetitive & focused practice, you can get just about as fast with a wheel gun (revolver) as with a semi-auto. Once you are empty, you can dump the brass, reload & be firing again in about 3-3.5 seconds consistently. I just takes some practice. Good video. This guy is very fast. Wowzi!

Move over Wild Bill, Billy the Kid, etal. All those old gunmen are lucky he was after them.

Can't beat the "Lead Dispencer":



[youtube]nSMOoqaGAT4[/youtube]



[youtube]F1BwUJ4--Qw[/youtube]



Spencer Hoglund is accurate in addition to being fast. I believe Hoglund took down the 12 shot record a couple years ago, and he did it with a single action instead of the double-action in the old-man video above.

snoscythe wrote:
http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=330703697



This one's going to eclipse $2K if I had to bet on it.

You are probably right about that. I is a pretty good looking Sterling with just a little wear. Even at that price it would be tempting but I have other places I need to put my money. I found a Chantilly on Guns America for $1,550.



I can't help but wonder what it would take to license the design and reproduce them. The thing that kept the gun from being popular was its price. Even back in the '90s it was a $1,000 when its competitors were selling for less than half that so the police and military could never afford it.



Then polymer frames started gaining popularity and suddenly the P7 was considered very heavy for its size.



I just love the way squeeze-cocking works. If a squeeze-cock were added to a competitively priced light weight alloy or polymer gun I think it would get a lot of people's attention.

snoscythe wrote:
Can't beat the "Lead Dispencer":



[youtube]nSMOoqaGAT4[/youtube]



[youtube]F1BwUJ4--Qw[/youtube]



Spencer Hoglund is accurate in addition to being fast. I believe Hoglund took down the 12 shot record a couple years ago, and he did it with a single action instead of the double-action in the old-man video above.

That's impressive. I'm speechless. He's an artist.