F
frdbtrSo it sounds to me like BYU graduated from player chemistry issues to coaching staff ones per the Wrubell tweets of the interview with Holmoe.
Archived Topic
Coaching staff chemistry issues?
by frdbtr · 10/29/2012
Advertisement
G
GuestThe staff chemistry issues tweet is very interesting. I don't think Doman is well liked on the staff.
C
Cougs_Rulefrdbtr wrote:
So it sounds to me like BYU graduated from player chemistry issues to coaching staff ones per the Wrubell tweets of the interview with Holmoe.
Graduated? You mean regressed, right? It's amazing the things you are learning now that your head is coming out of the sand. Keep watching for tweets and quotes and speculation. You think TH doesn't know that would happen when he revealed what he did? You don't think Bronco would "do the unthinkable" not to mention Riley's style of play change?
Ya, doesn't sound so far off to think that TH didn't go in and tell Bronco clean things up starting with Rley or there will be some changes.
F
frdbtrdmcougar wrote:So it sounds to me like BYU graduated from player chemistry issues to coaching staff ones per the Wrubell tweets of the interview with Holmoe.
Graduated? You mean regressed, right? It's amazing the things you are learning now that your head is coming out of the sand. Keep watching for tweets and quotes and speculation. You think TH doesn't know that would happen when he revealed what he did? You don't think Bronco would "do the unthinkable" not to mention Riley's style of play change?
Ya, doesn't sound so far off to think that TH didn't go in and tell Bronco clean things up starting with Rley or there will be some changes.
The word graduated was used purposely by me. I think you are reading way too much into that statement.
F
frdbtrhawkwing wrote:
The staff chemistry issues tweet is very interesting. I don't think Doman is well liked on the staff.
Are you thinking he was referencing Doman because that is the coach on the staff that you don't like? Do you have inside info?
Advertisement
C
Cougs_Rulefrdbtr wrote:The staff chemistry issues tweet is very interesting. I don't think Doman is well liked on the staff.
Are you thinking he was referencing Doman because that is the coach on the staff that you don't like? Do you have inside info?
It's no secret that Bronco doesn't exactly have the best relationship building with others. I have very close info from a brother of a coach who has indicated as much.
I do not have as much direct info relative to Dman and Bronco, but I have to believe that it is not great. Bronco calling shots on keeping Riley in when Dman had to know by watching closely that Rley was not good after the injury. Dman spoke several times in code that Riley was "injured horribly" , etc. I watched them on the sideline during the OSU game--there is no love there. It seemed very conflicted.
L
Lawboyhawkwing wrote:
The staff chemistry issues tweet is very interesting. I don't think Doman is well liked on the staff.
You'd think wrong on Doman.
Te chemistry issues are with respect to play calling(reynolds has chimed in) and Oline performance (underperformance).
DOman and DuPaix are great friends and go way back, and Doman is a great recruiter and pretty much loved on staff.
The issues are the fact that Bronco and Doman have not agreedto start RN in some games (Utah, BSU), Reynolds has chimed in on the scheme to get more passing insituted even with RN being a poor passer, and the fact that in spite of hte fact that the team went out of their way to redo the Strenght, Conditiong and Nutrition program, the Oline still has has some major issues, especially early.
If anyone expects major changes, don't. But a position caoch or two could be changing.
F
frdbtrLawboy wrote:The staff chemistry issues tweet is very interesting. I don't think Doman is well liked on the staff.
You'd think wrong on Doman.
Te chemistry issues are with respect to play calling(reynolds has chimed in) and Oline performance (underperformance).
DOman and DuPaix are great friends and go way back, and Doman is a great recruiter and pretty much loved on staff.
The issues are the fact that Bronco and Doman have not agreedto start RN in some games (Utah, BSU), Reynolds has chimed in on the scheme to get more passing insituted even with RN being a poor passer, and the fact that in spite of hte fact that the team went out of their way to redo the Strenght, Conditiong and Nutrition program, the Oline still has has some major issues, especially early.
If anyone expects major changes, don't. But a position caoch or two could be changing.
I think Doman should be given at least as much time as Anae was given. I would like to see the Oline coach changed though. The line has gotten worse every year since Grimes left. On the other hand, Grimes took over an oline mess and turned it into a dominating one in a couple of years. I want someone like him back on staff.
M
Mingjaifrdbtr wrote:
I think Doman should be given at least as much time as Anae was given.
Given as much time to do what? Produce? It's too late for that, because Anae's offense showed improvement in year 1 and were very productive in year 2.
Or are we just willing to give him 6 seasons as a matter of course...?
M
Marsfrdbtr wrote:
The staff chemistry issues tweet is very interesting. I don't think Doman is well liked on the staff.Are you thinking he was referencing Doman because that is the coach on the staff that you don't like? Do you have inside info?
This is the first I've heard of Doman being disliked, but I am not an insider. It does appear that Doman and Bronco have disagreed on both Jake Heaps and Riley Nelson, and probably James Lark and Taysom Hill as well. It is said that Weber is very well liked, even though he is not good at his job. Publicly, Bronco had previously called Doman the best QB Coach in the nation.
Advertisement
F
frdbtrMingjai wrote:I think Doman should be given at least as much time as Anae was given.
Given as much time to do what? Produce? It's too late for that, because Anae's offense showed improvement in year 1 and were very productive in year 2.
Or are we just willing to give him 6 seasons as a matter of course...?
Yeah, I think he should be given 6 years. Doman doesn't have Jeff Grimes as his oline coach and certainly hasn't had Sr John Beck at QB in his second year. People complained about Anae's vanilla play calling from day 1 and it only got worse without Beck as the QB in 07, 08, 09, and unbearable in 10. Doman deserves at least as much time as Anae.
C
CougarbibMy inside info, which may not represent universally held opinions, is that at least some players on offense really dislike Bronco, love Riley, Lark, Hill, Munns, Kuresa, and Olsen. IDK how they feel about Doman.
But get real - whatever turmoil level there is or is not is at most typical of a team that has had frustrating losses.
If the Demon Riley Nelson continues to beat who he is supposed to beat - the 5 game win streak to finish the season will fix whatever turmoil there is or is not.
[ Post made via Mobile Device ]
http://cougarcorner.com/images/mobile.png" alt="" loading="lazy" style="max-width:100%">
But get real - whatever turmoil level there is or is not is at most typical of a team that has had frustrating losses.
If the Demon Riley Nelson continues to beat who he is supposed to beat - the 5 game win streak to finish the season will fix whatever turmoil there is or is not.
[ Post made via Mobile Device ]
C
Cougs_RuleYes and those areas of frustration are usually warranted.
C
Cougarbibdmcougar wrote:
Yes and those areas of frustration are usually warranted.
The strength or lack thereof of any management structure is directly related to the creation of an environment where different points of view can be aired and debated resulting in decisions based on a more complete (360 degree) view of any situation.
[ Post made via Mobile Device ]
F
FlorwoodI do not have as much direct info relative to Dman and Bronco, but I have to believe that it is not great. Bronco calling shots on keeping Riley in when Dman had to know by watching closely that Rley was not good after the injury. Dman spoke several times ...
dmcougar, do you misspell Doman's name because you're typing from a mobile device with predictive spelling, you don't think he can "Do" the job, it's short hand for "demon", or because you think he is d'man?
Advertisement
C
Cougarfan87I think Bronco may have had some issues with Doman's play calling in the past that led to too many runs by the QB. He as much as said so. However, that shouldn't be taken to mean that they don't like each other. People can have opinions and disagree with each other professionally, and still get along fine at the end of the day. It happens in my work place all the time. Now if underperformance continued, changes would have to be made. I think that is the case on the Oline. The underperformance has continued for years, and now we can't lay the blame on fat, out of shape lineman. So the next variable to control for is the Oline coach. I think he is either reassigned or gone after this year. I think Doman has one more year to prove what the team can do against good teams, because Georgia Tech was not that good of a team (although props for winning a game two time zones away--that is tough no matter who you are playing).
L
LawboyALl I can say is that I have inside info on this. Someone who is around the team often at practice, every game day and travels with the team. HE sees a lot and knows details.
The issues is not that Doman is not liked--far from it. The issue is what I mentioned above. Personnel decisions--especially QB--has caused some issues on staff, and with TH as well, the fact we lost Heaps over choices in 2011 has caused issues. Another big issue was the play call that got Hill injured and the emphasis on QB runs as a crutch for a QB with limied passing skills. That crutch is being taken away and the O will now focus on adding quick pass plays instead of runs for the QB. 12-16 is too many. Way too many. And then performance issues by the Oline, when the program went out of its way to help them improve conditioning, health and everything else, with limited results to speak of thus far.
Again, some of these thigs are normal, especially when many think the team has underperformed based upon the skill in the program. Because it clearly has. We should be 7-2 right now. Heading towards 11-2. And a season that with teh schedule we had, many would be really pleased with. Instead, we aren;t, and hard questions are being asked and answered.
Hwever, we are seeing the strengths of this offense rise to the top right now. WIlliams running, Hoff, Apo and Friel catching passes, and not letting our QB run so much, and making him take care of hte football better. Doman is getting much better at his job, and has called some really good games now that certain changes ane emphasis have been made. HE called good games against OSU, ND, GT, and he won tough game against USU with a true freshman who limited mistakes. Doman is getting better, and is receiving hte right mentoring from other Cougar legends.
The issues is not that Doman is not liked--far from it. The issue is what I mentioned above. Personnel decisions--especially QB--has caused some issues on staff, and with TH as well, the fact we lost Heaps over choices in 2011 has caused issues. Another big issue was the play call that got Hill injured and the emphasis on QB runs as a crutch for a QB with limied passing skills. That crutch is being taken away and the O will now focus on adding quick pass plays instead of runs for the QB. 12-16 is too many. Way too many. And then performance issues by the Oline, when the program went out of its way to help them improve conditioning, health and everything else, with limited results to speak of thus far.
Again, some of these thigs are normal, especially when many think the team has underperformed based upon the skill in the program. Because it clearly has. We should be 7-2 right now. Heading towards 11-2. And a season that with teh schedule we had, many would be really pleased with. Instead, we aren;t, and hard questions are being asked and answered.
Hwever, we are seeing the strengths of this offense rise to the top right now. WIlliams running, Hoff, Apo and Friel catching passes, and not letting our QB run so much, and making him take care of hte football better. Doman is getting much better at his job, and has called some really good games now that certain changes ane emphasis have been made. HE called good games against OSU, ND, GT, and he won tough game against USU with a true freshman who limited mistakes. Doman is getting better, and is receiving hte right mentoring from other Cougar legends.
G
GunkThis normal for any group or organization that is under performing. Fingers are pointed, blame is laid, and resolutions made.
You have the under performers busy pointing fingers at upper management and colleagues while upper management is busy looking for bodies to throw under the bus. Happens all the time.
A good executive, which I suspect TH is, will be able to see through all the blaming, buses and bodies and make the right call.
Riley should not have been playing when hurt: Bronco's fault.
Riley should have been on a short leash from the start: Bronco's fault.
Going for 2 against BSU: Bronco's fault.
Lark should have started: Doman's fault.
QB runs should have been limited: Doman's fault.
Hill's injury: Doman's fault.
Poor OL: Weber's fault.
Heaps transferring: Heaps' fault.
[ Post made via Mobile Device ]http://cougarcorner.com/images/mobile.png" alt="" loading="lazy" style="max-width:100%">
You have the under performers busy pointing fingers at upper management and colleagues while upper management is busy looking for bodies to throw under the bus. Happens all the time.
A good executive, which I suspect TH is, will be able to see through all the blaming, buses and bodies and make the right call.
Riley should not have been playing when hurt: Bronco's fault.
Riley should have been on a short leash from the start: Bronco's fault.
Going for 2 against BSU: Bronco's fault.
Lark should have started: Doman's fault.
QB runs should have been limited: Doman's fault.
Hill's injury: Doman's fault.
Poor OL: Weber's fault.
Heaps transferring: Heaps' fault.
[ Post made via Mobile Device ]
C
CougarbibLawboy wrote:
ALl I can say is that I have inside info on this. Someone who is around the team often at practice, every game day and travels with the team. HE sees a lot and knows details.
The issues is not that Doman is not liked--far from it. The issue is what I mentioned above. Personnel decisions--especially QB--has caused some issues on staff, and with TH as well, the fact we lost Heaps over choices in 2011 has caused issues. Another big issue was the play call that got Hill injured and the emphasis on QB runs as a crutch for a QB with limied passing skills. That crutch is being taken away and the O will now focus on adding quick pass plays instead of runs for the QB. 12-16 is too many. Way too many. And then performance issues by the Oline, when the program went out of its way to help them improve conditioning, health and everything else, with limited results to speak of thus far.
Again, some of these thigs are normal, especially when many think the team has underperformed based upon the skill in the program. Because it clearly has. We should be 7-2 right now. Heading towards 11-2. And a season that with teh schedule we had, many would be really pleased with. Instead, we aren;t, and hard questions are being asked and answered.
Hwever, we are seeing the strengths of this offense rise to the top right now. WIlliams running, Hoff, Apo and Friel catching passes, and not letting our QB run so much, and making him take care of hte football better. Doman is getting much better at his job, and has called some really good games now that certain changes ane emphasis have been made. HE called good games against OSU, ND, GT, and he won tough game against USU with a true freshman who limited mistakes. Doman is getting better, and is receiving hte right mentoring from other Cougar legends.
These do not seem like very hard questions. QBs are running too much. But wait - RB injured too. If Williams gets injured - lack of depth at RB will become as glaring as at QB and OL and FB, and TE. Those are the tough questions.
All signs point to the OL for three years or more. Put an OL like OSU, ND, USC, and others put on the field - and all of the above will look better and the QB will not need to run so much.
I agree based on my inside info that the TH injury has been the major focal point. Irony if all irony for fans - the guy with the strong arm they crave - went down running too much. Why was that? He was not seeing open receivers and not hitting them when he did see them - but he was a brilliant runner.
Nobody is perfect. Not even Tom Holmoe. Ask Cal fans.
I like TH - but he and Bronco - through ridiculous scheduling decisions, have set the program up for many future disappointing losses that fans will have a tough time enduring to the end.
Bronco and Doman made it worse by not developing and measuring Nelson in 2008, Lark in 2010, and having open competition in 2011.
[ Post made via Mobile Device ]
C
Cougarbibfrdbtr wrote:
So it sounds to me like BYU graduated from player chemistry issues to coaching staff ones per the Wrubell tweets of the interview with Holmoe.
Someone posted a TH interview link but I could not get it to work. What exactly did TH say? In what context?
Mountain? Molehill? Or an actual story.
[ Post made via Mobile Device ]
This is an archived topic from the original CougarCorner forum. New replies are not accepted.