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From the Land of In-Between

by snoscythe · 9/30/2012

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snoscythe
Lest anyone think that, on the basis of my post-Hawaii posts, I want Nelson back as "the man," let me clear the air.



I think Hill did enough against Hawaii to win the starting job until Nelson is 100%--and I mean a legitimate 100%, not "Riley says he's 100% and he's got moxie" 100%. The coaches have shown that once Riley is on the field they prefer to wait to the point of "too late to make a difference" to change horses, and a less-than-100% Nelson is like putting this charming fellow under center:



http://images1.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20120511213537/villains/images/f/f3/Elijah_Price.jpg" alt="" loading="lazy" style="max-width:100%">



Then when Riley is 100%, you re-evaluate on the basis of Hill's progression or lack thereof. If performs against USU next week like he did against Hawaii, it's going to be a hard argument to put Nelson back on the field. Any thoughts of "he's done so much for the program, worked so hard, and he's got moxie" need to be shelved. Otherwise, we might as well bring Munns into the discussion on the basis of effort.



I believe that a 100% Riley Nelson is better than Hill was on Friday, but I have serious doubts that we will ever see him at 100% given the nature of his injury, and less-than-100% Riley Nelson plays like this charmer:



http://static6.businessinsider.com/image/4c88d3e87f8b9af65b4c0200/snooki.jpg" alt="" loading="lazy" style="max-width:100%">



You might as well put broken-armed Alisa in there and let him pull the trigger. Accuracy would probably be an improvement over BSU.



No matter what, Bronco needs to continue the line that Nelson will start if healthy, even if he knows Nelson is done for the season. Perhaps even give him a few snaps late in a game sometime in the next two weeks if the game is over late in the 4th quarter. Force opposing defenses to prep for both a leftie and a rightie......the offense needs every advantage it can get.
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SpiffCoug
To a certain extent, I think there are some similarities between BYU 2012 and the New England Patriots 2001.



Drew Beldsoe is the established starter. He gets hurt early in the season and a young and inexperienced Tom Brady comes in. Head Coach Bill Belichek initially says that Drew Bledso is the starter and that you can't lose your job to injury.



Tom Brady plays the remainder of the season - only to be injured in the AFC championship game. Drew Bledsoe is now the one coming in in relief, even though he had been healthy for some time, he never regained his starting position. He leads the Patriots to victory over the Steelers(?).



Bronco needs to ride the Taysom Hill train as long as he can. Let Riley get fully healthy.



Let's see how teams react to Taysom as they get more and more film on him.
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Guest
Spiff and Sno are both right. Riley Nelson should focus on healing, and coaching the other QBs on the sidelines and in and after practice like he did this week and before and during the game. Bronco should continue to announce that RN is the man and will play when his health permits. This will force teams to prepare for him and Hill. Let Hill get out there play and run the team. But this should really be Hill's team now.
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Lawboy
I actually saw tha Pats beat the Colts in 2001 at old Foxboro. What a dump that place was. Bledsoe was good that day, but yeah, I like that comparison.



Agree, if Riley gets the keys back to the car, he better not be impaired.
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TulaneVandyRiceCoug
hawkwing wrote:
Spiff and Sno are both right. Riley Nelson should focus on healing, and coaching the other QBs on the sidelines and in and after practice like he did this week and before and during the game. Bronco should continue to announce that RN is the man and will play when his health permits. This will force teams to prepare for him and Hill. Let Hill get out there play and run the team. But this should really be Hill's team now.

Ding! Ding! Ding! Yes, keep Riley the starter, have him do this thing while getting healed. Have Taysom play in the mean time. Have opponents prep for both. Send Riley back out when he is a true 100%.
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MesaCougFan
Brady didn't win the job from Bledsoe because he was a more prolific runner than Drew. Neither of them could / can run. Brady could make all the throws that Bledsoe could make at that time, And had a great upside.



Where the comparison doesn't fit, is that TH can't / doesn't / hasn't shown that he can make the throws that he needs to make as a QB to beat good teams that will take his legs out of the equation.



We will not win games against USU, OSU, ND or GT if our QB has more yards rushing than he has throwing the ball.
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scott715
Unless our D throws a shutout.
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Cougarbib
It will come down to penalties and turnovers - because our defense is very good. How good remains to be seen. We have not faced a good offense yet. USU and OSU will be good tests at home.



[ Post made via Mobile Device ] http://cougarcorner.com/images/mobile.png" alt="" loading="lazy" style="max-width:100%">
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Cougs_Rule
But back to the OP......

It's only a matter of time before Hill actually becomes more effective passing the ball than Riley. Three games? Probably just about the time we get to the ND game when Riley will all of a sudden be "healthy", again = which will mean more turnovers and yet again, another loss. Some Sr year legacy.
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stgeorgefan
Can someone please explain to me the difference between a defense preparing for Riley vs preparing for Taysom?

Coaches siad that Lark was moved to 3rd string because it kept the playbook basically the same.

If you were going to throw off defenses then say your going pro-style with James Lark...

What am I missing...honost inquiry
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Guest
stgeorgefan wrote:
Can someone please explain to me the difference between a defense preparing for Riley vs preparing for Taysom?

Coaches siad that Lark was moved to 3rd string because it kept the playbook basically the same.

If you were going to throw off defenses then say your going pro-style with James Lark...

What am I missing...honost inquiry

A defense that has to prepare for Reily has to review hours of film of Riley and prepare for tendencies of the leftie. Meanwhile there is little useful film of Lark.
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scott715
RN more of a pass threat short. TH more of a deep threat and better running threat.
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stgeorgefan
scott715 wrote:
RN more of a pass threat short. TH more of a deep threat and better running threat.

And yet if a team watches film of Taysom Hill from the Hawaii game it will all be short passes..

Both run the same offense...

A better question would be "is there that much of a difference between a lefty and a righty"

preparation wise?

If I'm a defense I stack the box. Play to stop the run and blitz often. 1 on 1 on the outside. Take a page out of BSU's playbook. An interview from TH last night mentioned that TH was still learning the mid to long pass game...

USU is very good stopping the run so far this year, I'd assume they will make Byu beat them through the air.
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Brayden Green
Taysom went deep a few times. A few of them, the longest, should have been caught but was not, and a PI on the play.



When they watch tape they will see someone that makes good reads and punishes you if you stack the box and go one on one to the outside.



Taysom makes good reads. He didn't make perfect throws, but that will come as he gets more comfortable with playing. He has a good progression. I think he will do fine. Much better than RN obviously, but probably better than Lark would too.
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stgeorgefan
BlueIsBetter wrote:
Taysom went deep a few times. A few of them, the longest, should have been caught but was not, and a PI on the play.



When they watch tape they will see someone that makes good reads and punishes you if you stack the box and go one on one to the outside.



Taysom makes good reads. He didn't make perfect throws, but that will come as he gets more comfortable with playing. .


My point exactly!! Not a deep threat when you didn't complete any and haven't shown that you could ( in 1.5 games)

I agree with you that it will come with time, I'm referrng to how defenses ( USU) will prepare different between RN and TH. I don't see any difference.. Like I said before; I can't see the difference between the two outside of Size, speed and throwing arm..
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stgeorgefan
Spoke to soon. DN has an article today....

"“They are both good quarterbacks and are both really good with their feet. It’s a similar preparation for each of the two quarterbacks,” safety McKade Brady said of Nelson and Taysom Hill. "
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snoscythe
The real reason to use Hill instead of Lark has nothing to do with what opposing defenses have to do to prepare--it has to do with what BYU's offense has to do to prepare.



With Hill in, and Nelson as a maybe, the defenses have to prep for both a lefty and a righty, but a lefty and a righty who use the same essential playbook. That means their scout team has to try to replicate the blocking schemes for a lefty and a righty on a week's notice, and their defense (notably DEs, OLBs, and CBs) have to prepare for the different release points and blocking schemes for lefty v. righty.....even if the scout team doesn't have a lefty to truly simulate that side. Imagine as the #1 DE not knowing if you're going to be going against a the left OT or the right OT---all you know is you get the blindside, but you don't know which is which, so you get to do both. However, you don't have to prep for a more traditional Lark as well.



For BYU, the OLine has been blocking for a lefty and righties the past 3 years, so that's not much of a factor. However, the playbook for Lark would be markedly different than the Hill/Nelson playbook, so by keeping Lark at 3, the offense can focus on plays that they can run with either Hill or Nelson without wasting time on Lark-specific plays that Hill/Nelson wouldn't be able to use effectively.



So yeah, having them prepare for Hill/Nelson makes their life harder while keeping our status quo. Having them prepare for Lark/Nelson would be even harder for them, but less efficient for us.
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stgeorgefan
thank you Sno for the detailed explanation.
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Mars
snoscythe wrote:
The real reason to use Hill instead of Lark has nothing to do with what opposing defenses have to do to prepare--it has to do with what BYU's offense has to do to prepare... The playbook for Lark would be markedly different than the Hill/Nelson playbook, so by keeping Lark at 3, the offense can focus on plays that they can run with either Hill or Nelson without wasting time on Lark-specific plays that Hill/Nelson wouldn't be able to use effectively. So yeah, having them prepare for Hill/Nelson makes their life harder while keeping our status quo. Having them prepare for Lark/Nelson would be even harder for them, but less efficient for us.

In other words, it's all Riley's fault. :whistle:
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Cougs_Rule
Wrong. It's Heaps fault. Man some of you guys have a short memory. ;-)
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