Why Riley Nelson Should Start if He's Health.

1. You shouldn't lose your starting spot because of injury. Other players might cover up injuries if they thought they would lose their starting position.



2. Nelson, I believe, still has the backing of the team. To lose the starting position because he was beat out by someone else is one thing but to have it taken away because of an injury wouldn't be right.



3. If Nelson struggles then Hill can be brought in with no pressure on him (Hill).



4. If Hill starts and struggles then Nelson comes in and succeeds this could lead to a confidence type of problem for Hill.

All good points. I have another one that trumps all of those; When Riley Nelson is healthy, he is the best QB on the roster.

Bronco speaks in secret code - mumbo jumbo - because



1: He does not want to feed the beasts - media and fans

2: He needs to maintain individual and team morale and unity

3: He does not want to give locker room material to future opponents

4: He likes to keep opponents guessing



This is what he said - known only by those who know or can break the code



Riley was taken out of the Weber State game after his injury - because we were way ahead of an inferior opponent and we could win without Riley - thus let Riley heal.



Vs Utah and BSU, he did not believe back-up QBs were ready to win vs those teams and opponents. So he could not afford to let Riley heal. He felt injured Riley gave us our best shot. He underestimated how much the injury would impact Riley's accuracy and arm strength. He pulled Riley when it became undeniable. IMHO, he should have made the change sooner.



He went for 2 Vs BSU for all the reasons he gave about momentum, but also had unspoken concerns that a kicking team that could miss two Vs UH with no pressure and have an ugly 3rd one, might miss a PAT on the road with deafening noise and an attempted block.



He rested Riley for UH and spent all week preparing Hill and one gameplan - not e

3 QBs and two game plans. He had a full week to get Hill ready. With Hill and Riley it is one game plan and the entire team can focus on one game plan. Sorry James Lark fans. He does not want to spell it out and provide locker room material for UH next year in Honolulu, but UH was expected to be inferior, so Nelson was not needed - this rest.



Now with Hill even more ready and even Lark getting more snaps, Bronco feels the back-up situation is more prepared and USU defense, although not U or BSU quality, is decent, but maybe not too strong to go with Hill if Nelson is not fully recovered.



Each week, the backups are even more ready, and while at home Vs teams not named ND, he will ve more likely to rest Riley and play the new kid.



With UH being inferior, he also felt it a good time to shake up the OL since C1 did not work and C2 - Retnolds is injured. So C3 did well vs inferior opponent at home and gained experience and Anae!s son, whom at least one CC poster called a wasted schollie when coach Anae was forced out, stepped in and gave that nasty and mean performance fans wanted.



That is what he said - so everyone can chillax



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He has not beaten a good team and is mediocre when healthy. I knew after the Tulsa game last year Riley Nelson is a journeyman type of quarterback. He does not possess the physical tools to play the position against top notch competition and that is what the majority of fans believe. BYU does not have the type of offensive line for them to compete against top notch defenses with Riley at quarterback. His turnovers have killed us the last two games and you cannot put all of that on an injury. They have to be factored into the equation. Hill has got too many ways he can beat a team and has played far better. I hearken back to the first two passes on simple flair passes with no pressure against Washington State where Riley missed his reciever's by five yards. The missed snap against Utah compared to all the low snaps last night. Hill is light years better than Nelson on the rollout or against pressure. BYU is good enough on defense and with Jamael and Taysom keeping the defense in the box they will throw the ball well against quality teams.

tjerbear wrote:
He has not beaten a good team and is mediocre when healthy. I knew after the Tulsa game last year Riley Nelson is a journeyman type of quarterback. He does not possess the physical tools to play the position against top notch competition and that is what the majority of fans believe. BYU does not have the type of offensive line for them to compete against top notch defenses with Riley at quarterback. His turnovers have killed us the last two games and you cannot put all of that on an injury. They have to be factored into the equation. Hill has got too many ways he can beat a team and has played far better. I hearken back to the first two passes on simple flair passes with no pressure against Washington State where Riley missed his reciever's by five yards. The missed snap against Utah compared to all the low snaps last night. Hill is light years better than Nelson on the rollout or against pressure. BYU is good enough on defense and with Jamael and Taysom keeping the defense in the box they will throw the ball well against quality teams.

Who exactl has Taysom Hill beat that was good?

The reason we had so many drops last night is because Hill is a freshman who is slow in his reads and doesn't get the ball out on time. Thus it gets to the reciever late and the db's have more time to react to the throw. This is not a criticism of Hill, he is going to end up being really good but is not there yet. He did pretty good in his throw game against one of the worst defenses in the entire country last night and shreded that same defense with his legs but USU has a top 15 rated defense and is going to be much better. I still don't want Riley to play next Friday unless he is 100% healthy but we are going to need Riley in order to beat OSU and ND. Folks the facts speak for themselves. Last Year Riley threw for over 300 yards against a better Hawaii defense in Hawaii. Hill is a freshman and looked like an athletic freshman last night. He made plays with his legs and his throw game was below average. Any good defense that watches that game is going to force him to throw, we will see if his throw game is good enough to compensate for that.

We threw the ball more in the Hawaii game last year. Riley didn't run much(still recovering from last year's injury). 2011, we rushed 38 times(Riley 7 for -3 yards), passed 38 times. 2012 we rushed 54 times(Hill 15 for 143 yards), passed 24 times. Don't know what Hill's results would have been if we focused on passing more yesterday, but the offensive gameplans were different between the 2 years. Hawaii was also at the end of the year when Riley had been getting in sync with the rest of the offense since early October. Not that that this comparison between the 2 games really says much about what we should or shouldn't do going forward, just a general observation.

The question is, what is considered "healthy?" He may be healthy enough to play but not healthy enough to play at his best, near his best, or better than Hill.

I don't know that I'd start him if he's Health, but if he's Death, it's a different story.

Any discussson of the Per should also facter in 68 yards rushing against Boise State and 148 against Hawai in less than 3 quarters. I guess all those third and fifteen and twenty first downs achieved do not have any relevence for the naysayers. Total offence for minutes played were equal for example.

When was the last time Riley Nelson was healthy?



2010 before Air Force? Earlier than that?



This whole argument is moot to me. He shouldn't be starting. If he does get healthy, it will be for only a one or two game stint, and then he will be back to 80% or below. RN is only good at sacrificing his body. He is like the football equivalent of the shortstop that rarely fields the ball cleanly, but always makes sure it hits him in the chest instead of getting past him.



THe only thing he does well is get banged up. Even THill does what Riley is good at safer, and better.

A BYU QB needs to be able to throw a ball that enables his playmakers to make plays. Riley has proven to be able to do that. He is a gamer and a winner. TCU 2011 was a game that Riley wins if special teams takes care of business. Utah 2012 is a game Riley wins if special teams takes care of business. Heading into BSU Riley is undefeated as the present starting QB at BYU and there is no debate. In spite of Riley's shortcomings against BSU, we should have won that game too.

MesaCougFan wrote:
A BYU QB needs to be able to throw a ball that enables his playmakers to make plays. Riley has proven to be able to do that. He is a gamer and a winner. TCU 2011 was a game that Riley wins if special teams takes care of business. Utah 2012 is a game Riley wins if special teams takes care of business. Heading into BSU Riley is undefeated as the present starting QB at BYU and there is no debate. In spite of Riley's shortcomings against BSU, we should have won that game too.

Clearly you have revealed yourself as an Riley advocate. Nothing wrong with that, just repeated posts almost defying stats and or potential.

Bib would you call you Rileys little sister or some other disparaging label. But he would actually know from having attended Riley Nelson family parties and seen you there that you were more likely a brother or uncle or at least some gender accurate relative or friend. ;)

creative45 wrote:
1. You shouldn't lose your starting spot because of injury. Other players might cover up injuries if they thought they would lose their starting position.

What about losing your starting job due to not revealing an injury and putting yourself before the team?

creative45 wrote:
2. Nelson, I believe, still has the backing of the team. To lose the starting position because he was beat out by someone else is one thing but to have it taken away because of an injury wouldn't be right.

What if your beat out because you played injured and didn't reveal it to the full extent?



I dont' know if this is what happened or how badly the coaches or Riley himself knew he was hurt but I think it's a different situation to lose your job to injury than to lose your job to playing poorly when you shouldn't be playing. If I was a teammate and heard Riley's comments about never pulling himself I don't know that I'd still be behind him as much.



Again, I don't know what happened but have just observed his play in the Utah and Boise game and heard his comments about never pulling himself. It sure looks as if either Bronco or Riley put Riley above the team.



I'm worried about Riley starting on Friday and boos being rained down on Bronco. If Riley starts, expect Bronco to make a few headlines about fans.

Cougarbib wrote:
Bronco speaks in secret code - mumbo jumbo - because



1: He does not want to feed the beasts - media and fans

2: He needs to maintain individual and team morale and unity

3: He does not want to give locker room material to future opponents

4: He likes to keep opponents guessing



This is what he said - known only by those who know or can break the code



Riley was taken out of the Weber State game after his injury - because we were way ahead of an inferior opponent and we could win without Riley - thus let Riley heal.



Vs Utah and BSU, he did not believe back-up QBs were ready to win vs those teams and opponents. So he could not afford to let Riley heal. He felt injured Riley gave us our best shot. He underestimated how much the injury would impact Riley's accuracy and arm strength. He pulled Riley when it became undeniable. IMHO, he should have made the change sooner.



He went for 2 Vs BSU for all the reasons he gave about momentum, but also had unspoken concerns that a kicking team that could miss two Vs UH with no pressure and have an ugly 3rd one, might miss a PAT on the road with deafening noise and an attempted block.



He rested Riley for UH and spent all week preparing Hill and one gameplan - not e

3 QBs and two game plans. He had a full week to get Hill ready. With Hill and Riley it is one game plan and the entire team can focus on one game plan. Sorry James Lark fans. He does not want to spell it out and provide locker room material for UH next year in Honolulu, but UH was expected to be inferior, so Nelson was not needed - this rest.



Now with Hill even more ready and even Lark getting more snaps, Bronco feels the back-up situation is more prepared and USU defense, although not U or BSU quality, is decent, but maybe not too strong to go with Hill if Nelson is not fully recovered.



Each week, the backups are even more ready, and while at home Vs teams not named ND, he will ve more likely to rest Riley and play the new kid.



With UH being inferior, he also felt it a good time to shake up the OL since C1 did not work and C2 - Retnolds is injured. So C3 did well vs inferior opponent at home and gained experience and Anae!s son, whom at least one CC poster called a wasted schollie when coach Anae was forced out, stepped in and gave that nasty and mean performance fans wanted.



That is what he said - so everyone can chillax



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All of this to the detriment of the team and the 2012 season. Were UT's backups ready last year against us? Probably not, but guess what? It was clear the starter sucked so they made a move. Why wait an entire game and a half? Are they afraid of hurting someone's feelings? This isn't everyone gets a ribbon football here.

frdbtr wrote:
The reason we had so many drops last night is because Hill is a freshman who is slow in his reads and doesn't get the ball out on time.

I had to chuckle at this because this is riley's biggest problem and he is a senior.

jonnylingo wrote:

The reason we had so many drops last night is because Hill is a freshman who is slow in his reads and doesn't get the ball out on time.

I had to chuckle at this because this is riley's biggest problem and he is a senior.

Yeah, I saw Hill go through his progressions a lot faster than Riley, actually.



Most of the time Riley doesn't even get past his #1 read (Hoffman, or sometimes Friel). HIll was looking around and got the ball to a lot of different receivers. Also, Apo got the ball, and was able to make a few things happen. Good thing too, since Hoffman was dropping everything thrown within 5 feet of him.

Doman just said that they'll wait for Riley to be healthy before playing him (a week or two), but that when they do, they'll have significantly less designed QB run plays.



Wait a minute...wasn't that Riley's one redeeming tangible, that he could run the ball?

So if he won't run, we're having him in there to do what, exactly? Throw? If we just want a throwing QB (and I can't BELIEVE I'm saying that about BYU!! :sick: ) why not just put in a QB who can actually, you know, throw? James Lark would seem to be the guy in that case.



But no, now we're playing for time hoping to get a QB back off of injury who can't throw and won't run. Good work Brando.

BlueIsBetter wrote:
HIll was looking around and got the ball to a lot of different receivers.

This. Very much this.

I don't know RN. I've never met a single player on the team. I grew up in Richland, WA, so I have an affinity for players from the Tri-Cities. I have stated before that I really dislike RN's style of play. He doesn't play the game like the QB legends at BYU should, but he is a competitor, motivator and most importantly a winner. As a starting QB at BYU, RN has won all the games he should have, and put us in a position to win the games that we didn't (sans BSU).



I am a BYU homer through and through. I have bled blue since I spent my Saturdays as a child in the early 80's traveling to Benton City to watch the Cougars play on the church satellite. I have defended my Cougars for years against the big bad BCS BS that accompanies the locations that I have lived and worked in. I host / am hosted by fellow Cougar fans in my home / their home every week cheering on the Blue & White. When the Cougars lose, I actually feel pain. When they win, it is the greatest moment of my week.



I am a little embarrassed to admit how important it is in my life that the Cougars win every game they play.



With this out in the open, I believe (in my arm chair opinion) that RN (healthy) gives us the best chance to win, so I am pulling for that. If TH puts a beat down on USU on Friday, and shows that he is two dimensional, and throws for more yards than he runs for my opinion as to who should be starting may change. If TH is leading the Cougars on Friday, there won't be anyone within the sound of my choice that will doubt my Allegiance to TH and the Cougars, I guarantee that!