O-Line Change v. QB Change

Now, I know that it wasn't the best opponent, but after the game I wondered what had more of an impact: the O-line change or the QB change. I would argue that the way the O-line played last night was a bigger deal that the QB change. Their intensity in play and much better blocking was critical to springing those big runs. What do you all think?

You may have a point, especially the way they picked up the blitz on the touchdown pass to Apo. However, there were a couple of very telling plays during the game that showed me the potential that Hill has. One was when Hill dropped back and had a defender in his face immediately. He was still able to unload the pass and get a gain of 8 on the play. This is the kind of play that Riley can make when healthy, but he couldn't have made in his current condition.



The future looks bright! 8)

Personally, I think it was the opponent change more than anything. I think the fans are getting ahead of themselves here in thinking all is well in Provo.

Agreed. HI is an inferior opponent, w/ inferior athletes, learning a new scheme that they really aren't suited for, with a head coach not suited to be a head coach.



Not a lot to take away from that. Kind of has a post spring game feel.



I like the o-line shake up, and am more excited about seeing what they can do against better talent.



I am a big proponent of the philosophy of "games are won and lost in the trenches".



If we have to rely on TH winning games w/ his arm, from what was displayed last night, we won't win w/ TH throwing the ball. I'm not suggesting that I don't think TH can get there, but he's not there yet.



If Riley is 100% last night, he has 22 for 30 for 350 & 4 TD's, 0 picks and he runs for 80 yds. and a score. BYU wins 63-0.

MesaCougFan wrote:
Agreed. HI is an inferior opponent, w/ inferior athletes, learning a new scheme that they really aren't suited for, with a head coach not suited to be a head coach.



Not a lot to take away from that. Kind of has a post spring game feel.



I like the o-line shake up, and am more excited about seeing what they can do against better talent.



I am a big proponent of the philosophy of "games are won and lost in the trenches".



If we have to rely on TH winning games w/ his arm, from what was displayed last night, we won't win w/ TH throwing the ball. I'm not suggesting that I don't think TH can get there, but he's not there yet.



If Riley is 100% last night, he has 22 for 30 for 350 & 4 TD's, 0 picks and he runs for 80 yds. and a score. BYU wins 63-0.

Since Riley has done the above now many times, what, ZERO. G back and look at all the patsy games and consider the final score. Yes, this is TH's FIRST start. FIRST. Three more games and TH will have caught up and passed a healthy Riley.

A healthy Riley proved on the field of play against a better HI team in Honolulu last year that he was a better QB (per) than TH did last night in Provo. My opinion is that a healthy RN generates the stats listed above.

Fair enough. And I certainly wold prefer a healthy Riley. But he hasn't been since the second quarter of Weber.

Obviously the biggest change here was opponent. This was the worst team we've played so far this year, including Weber State.

Agreed. It will be interesting to see if our adjusted o-line can control the line of scrimmage against the Aggies? USU is probably going to be a tougher opponent than either the U or BSU. They are coached well and have a good stable of athletes. We better be clicking on all cylinders!

snoscythe wrote:
Personally, I think it was the opponent change more than anything. I think the fans are getting ahead of themselves here in thinking all is well in Provo.

Amen. If we are able to smoke USU next week that will be a good sign. However, you can't judge a team by how they play at home. I want to see a legit road win w/o 15 penalties and 5 TO's.

I thought the OL played much more aggressively last night than they did in previous games. The change in mindset was a welcome one.

The added "LEAN" mass to the O-line might have helped a bit too

MesaCougFan wrote:
A healthy Riley proved on the field of play against a better HI team in Honolulu last year that he was a better QB (per) than TH did last night in Provo. My opinion is that a healthy RN generates the stats listed above.

Passing yes. Running no. Hill has a top end speed Riley does not have. Same with Williams having speed Alisa does not. Our speed helped us.

Lawboy wrote:

A healthy Riley proved on the field of play against a better HI team in Honolulu last year that he was a better QB (per) than TH did last night in Provo. My opinion is that a healthy RN generates the stats listed above.

Passing yes. Running no. Hill has a top end speed Riley does not have. Same with Williams having speed Alisa does not. Our speed helped us.

Both players were very impressive with their speed, as well as the o-line's improved nastiness. I hope it looks the same against USU.

The reason RGIII is all world is because even though he has top end speed (world class in fact), he also makes the throws QB's make at the highest level. He puts the ball where his play makers need it to be for them to make plays (I.e. Riley to MJ 2011 vs. USU). Don't get me wrong, I have rarely been impressed with Riley's ball, but he regularly (when healthy) puts the ball where it needs to be for his playmakers to make plays.



TH is an impressive / elusive runner. He's exciting! What He hasn't done is make a throw that allows a playmaker to make a play. Honestly, he hasn't really even make the easy throws look easy. I have no doubt that he will get there, but he's not there yet, and good teams will not be beaten by a QB who out gains his arm with his feet.

I would disagree. He made several reads and throws that allowed the WRs to make a play. Hoffman missed about 5 catches on the night, one of them for a large gain. There was a PI on that play too, but he still should have caught it for about a 40 yard gain. It was right in his ribcage.



It was the qb change.



The Oline was better at run blocking, but I watched them from the stands all night, and they were getting fooled with simple twists from the Dline, and getting pressure all night long. T Hill was actually that good at picking up the reads and dumping off, and knowing where the blitz was coming from pre-snap (something Riley is virtually oblivious to).



Everyone points to the play that was a quick out to a WR, and the defensive back jumped on the play, and if T Hill would have thrown it the ball would have been intercepted. T Hill recognized this and tucked the ball down for a 6 yard gain or so. Riley would have thrown that (if the intended target was Hoffman), and it would have gotten intercepted, probably for a pick 6.



I think at this point, a healthy Riley - if that even exists anymore - is still not as good as T Hill. A healthy Riley might have more poise to make some of these touch throws, but Hill still has a much better arm, and better vision (not to exclude far superior athleticism).



T HIll should be the qb going forward. Why not use Riley at fullback? Pritchard isn't doing jack squat. And if Riley wants to play special teams and fullback to "just get out on the field" then let him. But not at qb anymore. He just isn't a good option anymore (see what I did there?).

I was really impress with Famika Anae. The added lbs on the OL replacements seemed to help. For whatever reason the OL starters fro week 1-3 were getting beat badly.

Hawaii has a poor poor d-line granted, but in response to the question I believe it was the

1.Oline

2.Qb

3.opponent

MesaCougFan wrote:
The reason RGIII is all world is because even though he has top end speed (world class in fact), he also makes the throws QB's make at the highest level. He puts the ball where his play makers need it to be for them to make plays (I.e. Riley to MJ 2011 vs. USU). Don't get me wrong, I have rarely been impressed with Riley's ball, but he regularly (when healthy) puts the ball where it needs to be for his playmakers to make plays.



TH is an impressive / elusive runner. He's exciting! What He hasn't done is make a throw that allows a playmaker to make a play. Honestly, he hasn't really even make the easy throws look easy. I have no doubt that he will get there, but he's not there yet, and good teams will not be beaten by a QB who out gains his arm with his feet.

Eh...not sure I agree with this completely.



Riley could hardly make a throw his first two years at BYU. It wasn't until last year that he started making his throws and it was against the tail-end of our schedule. Riley wasn't a world beater against Tulsa last year and he certainly had trouble against TCU. So, to say Riley was able to put the ball where his play makers needed it is a bit of an over statement. Plus, how many of those "play making" passes were well designed plays/throws vs. last minute chucks and prayers.



Hill is playing for the first time in over 3 years. Guy deserves some major slack when it comes to timing and syncing with the WRs. There is noticeable improvement in Hill from game to game. He'll be money soon enough, assuming he doesn't get injured from Doman using him like a RB.

snoscythe wrote:
Personally, I think it was the opponent change more than anything. I think the fans are getting ahead of themselves here in thinking all is well in Provo.

I agree with this. The good news is that after the next four games we will know exactly where we are.

I do not want to underestimate hte personalle changes bcause I think they are necessary. We need more toughness from our Oline, espcially in the interior, and adding Anae and Viai gives it to us. However, they are both still really rough. But thegame experience and film on their performance will help a lot.



Hill playing well helped also.



But fact is, Hawaii was just bad. 368 yards on the ground bad.



We will have a better idea after Friday night.