Gripes against Bronco (from a Big Bronco Supporter)

1. The Utah losses



2005 - I can't help but feel the record should be 4-3 right now in favor of Bronco. If, for no other reason, 4 games have been played in Provo and 3 in SLC.



2008 - Maybe we wouldn't have won this game but we were keeping things very close until an utter breakdown by the coaches and the players. No excuse for getting blown out the way we did.



2010 - On paper we had no business being in this game. Yet, we had a win right in our grasp and gave it away.



2011 - the worst loss ever under Bronco's tenure. Say what you want about Whittingham (I hate his guts) but he would never lose AT HOME. To HIS RIVAL. By THAT

MUCH.







2. Slow Starts



In 5 of the 7 seasons under Bronco, we've started 1-2. This suggests that BYU struggles against non-conference teams (ones it isn't familiar with), especially ranked/BCS teams, and only settles in once conference play starts.



* Our over all record vs. Ranked/BCS teams is 12-19 (.387).



* BYU has only 4 wins against teams above .700. And 2 of those were against Northern Iowa and Eastern Illinois.



In the 2 years we started out 3-0 (2008) and 2-1 (2009), we eventually suffered pathetic losses to TCU and Florida State.







3. Bronco being caught unprepared



Examples...



2007 Tulsa game - found ourselves in a shootout by a team who obviously had us circled.

2008 TCU game - didn't see the buzz saw we were walking into.

2009 Florida St game - embarrassing home loss after big win against Oklahoma.







4. Getting taken to the woodshed again and again by TCU



We lose to the Frogs by 25 points in 2008, 31 points in 2009, 28 points in 2010. Where were the adjustments? Why was there not at least some improvement in our ability to compete with them? Bronco has no answers for Patterson.







5. Increasing loss margins



2005 Avg Loss Margin - 12 points



2006 Avg Loss Margin - 5 points



2007 Avg Loss Margin - 8.5 points



2008 Avg Loss Margin - 19.7 points



2009 Avg Loss Margin - 28.5 points



2010 Avg Loss Margin - 17.2 points



2011 Avg Loss Margin - 18.3 points









6. Other Things...



1. For a time, Bronco seemed to lose that hard-nosed, down-and-dirty football coach style and was acting more like a distant administrator. Fortunately that changed.



2. Bronco and Co. seemingly forgetting to stress such fundamentals like ball security, despite it being one of Bronco's 4 keys to winning.

KingCoug wrote:
* BYU has only 4 wins against teams above .700. And 2 of those were against Northern Iowa and Eastern Illinois.

Umm... MOST teams don't have many wins against teams above .700. That's kind of the reason why they have records above .700 - they don't lose many games. Most teams that are above .700 win 10 or more games in a year.

SpiffCoug wrote:


Umm... MOST teams don't have many wins against teams above .700. That's kind of the reason why they have records above .700 - they don't lose many games. Most teams that are above .700 win 10 or more games in a year.

Yes, but I think my point still stands. If BYU wants to break out of that 10 or 11 win ceiling, go undefeated, and make it to a major bowl; it's going to have to beat those kinds of teams.

KingCoug wrote:

Umm... MOST teams don't have many wins against teams above .700. That's kind of the reason why they have records above .700 - they don't lose many games. Most teams that are above .700 win 10 or more games in a year.

Yes, but I think my point still stands. If BYU wants to break out of that 10 or 11 win ceiling, go undefeated, and make it to a major bowl; it's going to have to beat those kinds of teams.

I'm curious how many teams have a .700 win rate over teams with a .700 win rate over the last 6 years.

KingCoug wrote:
1. The Utah losses



2011 - the worst loss ever under Bronco's tenure. Say what you want about Whittingham (I hate his guts) but he would never lose AT HOME. To HIS RIVAL. By THAT

MUCH.

I may not agree with everything you wrote. But I do agree with this 100%. Well, actually - I think that this statement isn't quite strong enough.This was the most embarrassing loss in the history of BYU sports. Totally unacceptable, and I still can't believe it happened. I will have nightmares about this game for the rest of my life. Disgusting. Thanks for bringing it back up. Jerk.

Y 4 Ever wrote:


I may not agree with everything you wrote. But I do agree with this 100%. Well, actually - I think that this statement isn't quite strong enough.This was the most embarrassing loss in the history of BYU sports. Totally unacceptable, and I still can't believe it happened. I will have nightmares about this game for the rest of my life. Disgusting. Thanks for bringing it back up. Jerk.

I bring it up because it still haunts me as well. It will be a long time, and he has to do a lot, for me to forgive Bronco for it. I was at the game with a friend and we left during the 4th quarter. Just couldn't take it anymore.



Later, when I heard Bronco was disappointed to see the fans leave, I wanted to scream in his face. And, like I said, I'm usually a big Bronco defender.

I should also add that I'm still disgusted by the way our defense gave up in the Utah game last year. That's a far worse indictment than them just losing to a better team.



Yes, the offense was a joke. And I'm sure it got tiring for the defense to keep having to go out on the field again and again after the offense turned the ball over.



But you don't just throw in the towel! You keep doing your job. And then you let your fellow teammates on offense have it when you're in the locker room. Heck, break another guy's jaw if you have to.



BUT YOU DON'T GIVE UP LIKE THAT!



WHERE IS THE HEART?!!!!

KingCoug wrote:
I should also add that I'm still disgusted by the way our defense gave up in the Utah game last year. That's a far worse indictment than them just losing to a better team.



Yes, the offense was a joke. And I'm sure it got tiring for the defense to keep having to go out on the field again and again after the offense turned the ball over.



But you don't just throw in the towel! You keep doing your job. And then you let your fellow teammates on offense have it when you're in the locker room. Heck, break another guy's jaw if you have to.



BUT YOU DON'T GIVE UP LIKE THAT!



WHERE IS THE HEART?!!!!

The team's heart was on the bench waiting for game and a half before getting his chance to breath life, passion and heart into the team.

BTW - if the OP stops whining for a moment and runs the numbers - just substitute Lavell Edwards for Bronco and - exact same result.



Sheesh.



This is a prime example of a whiny fan - that thinks he is entitled to an elite team - and one that absolutely never quits - and then he or she leaves ie QUITS on his team in the. 4th quarter of the rivalry game - the very game he is upset at the D for quitting in.



How ironic.



News Flash - BSU, TCU, and U have very good coaches. Very good. Almost no recruiting restrictions, and are not out there beating .700 teams every week either.



Run all the numbers. Ignorance can be bliss - until you post it.



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Cougarbib2 wrote:
BTW - if the OP stops whining for a moment and runs the numbers - just substitute Lavell Edwards for Bronco and - exact same result.



Sheesh.



This is a prime example of a whiny fan - that thinks he is entitled to an elite team - and one that absolutely never quits - and then he or she leaves ie QUITS on his team in the. 4th quarter of the rivalry game - the very game he is upset at the D for quitting in.



How ironic.



News Flash - BSU, TCU, and U have very good coaches. Very good. Almost no recruiting restrictions, and are not out there beating .700 teams every week either.



Run all the numbers. Ignorance can be bliss - until you post it.



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Once again, I'm usually the guy defending Bronco. But I am objective. And the criticism stands. Simply observing these problems doesn't necessarily make me "whiny." It's not like I'm calling for him to leave.

KingCoug wrote:

BTW - if the OP stops whining for a moment and runs the numbers - just substitute Lavell Edwards for Bronco and - exact same result.



Sheesh.



This is a prime example of a whiny fan - that thinks he is entitled to an elite team - and one that absolutely never quits - and then he or she leaves ie QUITS on his team in the. 4th quarter of the rivalry game - the very game he is upset at the D for quitting in.



How ironic.



News Flash - BSU, TCU, and U have very good coaches. Very good. Almost no recruiting restrictions, and are not out there beating .700 teams every week either.



Run all the numbers. Ignorance can be bliss - until you post it.



[ Post made via Mobile Device ] http://cougarcorner.com/images/mobile.png" alt="" loading="lazy" style="max-width:100%">

Once again, I'm usually the guy defending Bronco. But I am objective. And the criticism stands. Simply observing these problems doesn't necessarily make me "whiny." It's not like I'm calling for him to leave.

It is like you QUIT in the 4th quarter. Many fans like you QUIT in the 4th quarter of the miracle bowl and did not realize until the next day what they missed.



I lived in Chicago and had to watch the Miracle Bowl on delayed broadcast. It ended at about 3:00AM. I never quit.



BYU needs elite fans. I am not claiming to be one. But, I have never turned off a BYU game early on TV or left early from the stadium. Never. Regardless of the opponent or the weather. Never.



Look in the mirror. Man should not ask what his cougars can do for him - but what he can do for his Cougars: JFK commenting on Marilyn Monroe and RFK.



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Cougarbib2 wrote:



It is like you QUIT in the 4th quarter. Many fans like you QUIT in the 4th quarter of the miracle bowl and did not realize until the next day what they missed.



I lived in Chicago and had to watch the Miracle Bowl on delayed broadcast. It ended at about 3:00AM. I never quit.



BYU needs elite fans. I am not claiming to be one. But, I have never turned off a BYU game early on TV or left early from the stadium. Never. Regardless of the opponent or the weather. Never.



Look in the mirror. Man should not ask what his cougars can do for him - but what he can do for his Cougars: JFK commenting on Marilyn Monroe and RFK.



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Math was never my strongest subject but, trailing 54-10 late in the 4th quarter, I don't think there was much chance of a Miracle Bowl-like comeback. :whistle:



And there's just some things no fan, even the most die-hard fan, should ever have to witness. I'd say getting thumped by your rival, on your own field, by 44 points is one of those. Especially when much of that loss was due to the team quitting. It was a complete disgrace. There's nothing you can do but leave. Bronco needed to see that that kind of catastrophe just isn't acceptable. Ever.

What about losing in back-to-back years to your main rival by a combined score of 77-13? Sometimes everything comes together to conspire against you. Sometimes everything that can go wrong, does go wrong. Even for elite programs.



Kind of like Texas and Oklahoma in 2003 and 2004

KingCoug wrote:

It is like you QUIT in the 4th quarter. Many fans like you QUIT in the 4th quarter of the miracle bowl and did not realize until the next day what they missed.



I lived in Chicago and had to watch the Miracle Bowl on delayed broadcast. It ended at about 3:00AM. I never quit.



BYU needs elite fans. I am not claiming to be one. But, I have never turned off a BYU game early on TV or left early from the stadium. Never. Regardless of the opponent or the weather. Never.



Look in the mirror. Man should not ask what his cougars can do for him - but what he can do for his Cougars: JFK commenting on Marilyn Monroe and RFK.



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Math was never my strongest subject but, trailing 54-10 late in the 4th quarter, I don't think there was much chance of a Miracle Bowl-like comeback. :whistle:



And there's just some things no fan, even the most die-hard fan, should ever have to witness. I'd say getting thumped by your rival, on your own field, by 44 points is one of those. Especially when much of that loss was due to the team quitting. It was a complete disgrace. There's nothing you can do but leave. Bronco needed to see that that kind of catastrophe just isn't acceptable. Ever.

Yeah - he was probably thinking everything was pretty acceptable until you sent him that message. But yeah - in their worst hour - abandon them. Clearly a team should not be supported nor watched when they have no chance of winning.



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It all comes down to utah 2011. I'll have to say that is the first BYU game I turned off in a LONG time. I was so disgusted I couldn't watch anymore. I left my in laws house shortly after the muffed punt and utah score. I didn't turn it back on and just watched the tweets in horror as I saw utah score again and again. It was absolutely horrifying. I think it will take a long time and some BYU dominance over utah for the fans to forgive Bronco for that one. Having said that, if you think for a second that behind closed doors Bronco didn't let the team know how unacceptable that loss was, you don't know him very well. In the media, he glossed it over because he will never throw his players under the bus in the media but I can guarantee you that the team learned how unacceptable that loss was.

frdbtr wrote:
It all comes down to utah 2011. I'll have to say that is the first BYU game I turned off in a LONG time. I was so disgusted I couldn't watch anymore. I left my in laws house shortly after the muffed punt and utah score. I didn't turn it back on and just watched the tweets in horror as I saw utah score again and again. It was absolutely horrifying. I think it will take a long time and some BYU dominance over utah for the fans to forgive Bronco for that one. Having said that, if you think for a second that behind closed doors Bronco didn't let the team know how unacceptable that loss was, you don't know him very well. In the media, he glossed it over because he will never throw his players under the bus in the media but I can guarantee you that the team learned how unacceptable that loss was.

I am sure he said a lot. But actions speak louder than words. Losses to Utah are easier to understand given the teams being roughly equal lately.



But losses to USU cause action. In 2010 - Hill was fired. Bronco took over the defense. In 2011 - Heaps was demoted 3RD Quarter. Not a minute too soon.



Both years - there was talk after the U loss - but nobody got fired - and Heaps lived on to lose to USU.



If BYU loses a 3RD in a row to U - I wonder if Bronco will take any dramatic moves.

LSU had more wins against good ranked teams last year than BYU has had in a decade.



BYU has to improve. Fact of the matter.

Lawboy wrote:
LSU had more wins against good ranked teams last year than BYU has had in a decade.



BYU has to improve. Fact of the matter.

OK - we are not LSU

Compare and Contrast

Head Coach Salary

Assistant Coach Salaries

Fan Fervor

Stadium

Game Day Experience

Tiger Tails vs Cougar Tails

Recruiting restrictions, if any

Conference affiliation

BCS Access

Part of the Country where football is not 5th priority

Other



What do you think needs to step up for BYU to become LSU



Hint - LSU had not always been LSU - what changed?

Oregon had not always been Oregon - what changed?



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Cougarbib2 wrote:

LSU had more wins against good ranked teams last year than BYU has had in a decade.



BYU has to improve. Fact of the matter.

OK - we are not LSU

Compare and Contrast

Head Coach Salary

Assistant Coach Salaries

Fan Fervor

Stadium

Game Day Experience

Tiger Tails vs Cougar Tails

Recruiting restrictions, if any

Conference affiliation

BCS Access

Part of the Country where football is not 5th priority

Other



What do you think needs to step up for BYU to become LSU



Hint - LSU had not always been LSU - what changed?

Oregon had not always been Oregon - what changed?



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Hardcore Cheating! :D

What to do to improve? That is simple. Win. Beat the top teams on the schedule. TCU did it. Boise State has done it. So has Utah. Beat big names teams, hoe or away, in gAmes that matter.



2012 offers many chances to do it. So will 2013 and 2014. But gotta start now and build from there. No more blow out home losses( Utah, florida state and TCU x2 to name a few). And win some big road games.



Just win.