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Latest possible B12 expansion rumors

by Lawboy · 5/3/2012

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Lawboy
There is more momentum out there for this option right now. The Big XII wants to nab Notre Dame for Olympic Sports, but if they do, if creates an imbalance. So they need to find a school willing to join for football only. Enter BYU.



http://www.cbssports.com/collegefootball/blog/brett-mcmurphy/18943073" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

"Industry sources told CBSSports.com if the Big 12 does expand Louisville would be its first target as a full member and UL would leave the Big East. The Big 12 also has hopes to try and sway Notre Dame to join the league, either as an all-sports member or just for as an Olympic sports member."



The UL Boards have more on this as well:



http://mbd.scout.com/mb.aspx?s=17&f=2759&t=8962935&p=2" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;



Freddyville Post:



"It appears that BYU might be IN for Football Only... with some guaranteed games in other sports.

And If the rumors of the raid on the ACC are true Florida State and Clemson will be on their way."



How would you feel with BYU in BXII for football only, and WCC for the rest, but with guaranteed games vs. B12 teams for all other sports? I am all for it.
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CougarClaw
sounds good to me.



Bring on Texas, Oklahoma, florida St and Clemsons! :D





and the annual 6-6 years! :~(
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Mingjai
Lawboy wrote:
Freddyville Post:



"It appears that BYU might be IN for Football Only... with some guaranteed games in other sports."


I'd prefer all sports in the Big XII, but if it's between football independence and football in the Big XII, I definitely prefer the Big XII.



I'm enjoying basketball in the WCC, but the problem is the current depth of the WCC could affect BYU's NCAA tourney status. The bottom of the conference is generally going be worse than the bottom of, e.g., the MWC in most years. If BYU got some guaranteed home-home agreements with Big XII schools in basketball to supplement their current scheduling--say three games a year--that would bring some needed opportunities to bump up BYU's SOS. Bring on Allen Fieldhouse!
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Cougs_Rule
No offense intended Counsel, but, blah,blah blah, first and foremost, relative to these rumors. This would be medical malpractice.



Second, the Roadmap to unmasking and matasticizing BYU's malady of mediocrity is... (not sorry to mix my metaphors)---BYU to the Big 12.

Seasonal 6 and 6 sickness may as well be diagnosed with 666, because it includes as its symptomology, a certain quarantine from the ESPN love train, significant reduction in weekly access and tv viewership of our beloved Cougs, and increased reluctance by future big recruits--such as they are.



Don't do it Dr CecilO! Don't let Mr Tom expose us to this malady.
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Guest
dmcougar wrote:
No offense intended Counsel, but, blah,blah blah, first and foremost relative to rumors.



Second, the Roadmap to the unmasking and matasticizing of BYU's mediocrity (not sorry to mix my metaphors)---BYU to the Big 12. 6 and 6 sickness may as well be diagnosed with 666, because it includes as it symptomology, quarantine from the ESPN love train, significant reduction in weekly access and tv viewership weekly to our Cougs, and running for the exits by our recruits--such as they are.


So you're hypothesis is that BYU would do worse recruiting as part of the Big 12 than Independent or part of the MWC? I'm just trying to understand your negativity here.
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Gunk
I like it.



Football gets a conference and I still get to watch BYU basketball come to town 3 times a year.



I think we'd do better than 6 - 6. Bronco might actually step up his game if he was playing the Big12. Might add a bit more motivation to our players too. Gives us something to prove. Right now...we lose one game and there's nothing left to prove.
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Cougs_Rule
Utah may or may not survive sub par seasons. But if they do, it will be because the bottom of the PAC is worse than the bottom of the Big 12. WHich puts Utah in their worst seasons in the middle or in a good season near or at the top of the PAC--which of course effects recruiting. But if Utah is middle to lower year over year, then they end up resigned to a Washington state and recent Washington existence. How many times was Utah in tv last year?



Byu would rarely if ever be at the top of the Big 12. And more likely and often in the middle to lower end. ESPN won't want us. Big 12 network, aka longhorns network, won't show us; the Big 12 commish, also known as the Presidents of UT and OU, won't allow byu to have any favorable or advantageous circumstances and will be viewed as the "football only" red-headed, mal-deformed, MORMON, step-child, patsy; unworthy of consideration, or visibility, that very few big recruits would want to come here.

But this should be no surprise, many societies over the years have longed to be a part of Babylon acceptance and noteworthy ness. National recognition will come more readily from crappy November schedules than dwelling in the basement of the big 12. But hey! Some of you guys Will get to see your "legit" teams in Provo, won't you. It wasn't fun at All to get spanked by a mediocre Florida State, was it. That would happen more than not. Beating Texas A&M and or Miami as awesome as it was, came with two of BYU's best ever qb''s.how often does that happen?

So, yes, a winning program equals better recruiting. Because even the suspension of belief, the very shroud and mask of 10 win seasons looks and feels and results in a winning program to fans and recruits. Recruits do not want to be a part of a losing program.
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Cougs_Rule
Gunk wrote:
I like it.



Football gets a conference and I still get to watch BYU basketball come to town 3 times a year.



I think we'd do better than 6 - 6. Bronco might actually step up his game if he was playing the Big12. Might add a bit more motivation to our players too. Gives us something to prove. Right now...we lose one game and there's nothing left to prove.


Might? Because he's not giving his all now? Do you think that he is going to elevate his football priority to 2nd? Do you think BYU will magically find more motivation than in a game at home vs Utah? Oh wait, that was Heaps' fault and we gave him the boot, so that should be fixed this year.
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Mars
dmcougar wrote:
National recognition will come more readily from crappy November schedules than dwelling in the basement of the big 12. But hey! Some of you guys Will get to see your "legit" teams in Provo, won't you. It wasn't fun at All to get spanked by a mediocre Florida State, was it. That would happen more than not.

This post smells strongly of vinegar and water.
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Ungoy
I am all for football only to Big12. Fantastic teams playing in Provo, greater recruitment of high profile athletes, motivation to bring your 'A' game every week. I would love football in the B12.
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Gunk
dmcougar wrote:
I like it.



Football gets a conference and I still get to watch BYU basketball come to town 3 times a year.



I think we'd do better than 6 - 6. Bronco might actually step up his game if he was playing the Big12. Might add a bit more motivation to our players too. Gives us something to prove. Right now...we lose one game and there's nothing left to prove.


Might? Because he's not giving his all now? Do you think that he is going to elevate his football priority to 2nd? Do you think BYU will magically find more motivation than in a game at home vs Utah? Oh wait, that was Heaps' fault and we gave him the boot, so that should be fixed this year.


Who's to say Bronco is giving his all? Aside from God, the only other person even remotely able to know what Bronco is capable of is Bronco. Are you saying Bronco is giving his all and therefore there is no more room for improvement? He's hit his apex? I think even Bronco would disagree with that.



I'll give him the benefit of the doubt and say Bronco is currently giving it his all. That doesn't mean there isn't room for improvement or he isn't capable of bringing it up a notch. And to improve there has to be two things: 1) Recognition there is room to improve; 2) Sufficient motivation to improve.



Funny thing about motivation is that it's somewhat contingent on need and one's environment. A cat backed into a corner fights a lot harder than it ever did before as there is a lot more motivation.



In the Big12 we'd suddenly be facing some big dogs, and I believe that might just provide Bronco enough motivation to coach like he's never coached before. A little desperation, IMO, would do us good.



Right now, I don't think we're desperate enough. Turn the pressure on and we'll see what we're really capable of.
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Cougs_Rule
This is such a stretch beyond reality. A wing and a prayer. The problem is we only have a prayer now (also known as "desperation") and a very few, very very few wings (high end players).

You think we could compete week in and week out in the Big 12? We barely have enough real athletes and recruits to compete with our current schedule. We didnt even have enough players to compete within our own team during the spring.



The basic premise I seen dominating this discussion for the pro-big 12 folks is this: "if we get into the Big 12 our recruiting would improve." if we accept that premise then we must conclude about our current circumstances that we do not have the recruits now to compete in the Big 12. So, if we want to roll the dice and believe that "If we go, they will come", that is a big gamble. The risk is BYU gets set back at least a decade or more into current level recruiting (since Bronco has clearly identified which recruit works here and who doesn't). And if we don't win, can't protect home field, fans will not be as enamered with the mere thought of "oooh goodie, we get to see another Sooner team come to Provo, right after we justed played UT the week before, and get our ars handed to us." Nope. That will fade quickly when we can't compete and WIN. And if we don't WIN, recruiting suffers even more.

Big gamble just to get "ACCESS" to that phony, mythical Bull Crap System.

We already have access!!! It's called, go undefeated!! It's called, dont get blown out by your rival. It's called rankings in the top 20 every year.
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SpiffCoug
I'm a firm believer that BYU's recruiting is independent of BYU's affiliations. BYU recruits who they recruit. That's not going to change if BYU is in the MWC, WAC, WCC, BigXII, PAC12 or Big West.
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frdbtr
SpiffCoug wrote:
I'm a firm believer that BYU's recruiting is independent of BYU's affiliations. BYU recruits who they recruit. That's not going to change if BYU is in the MWC, WAC, WCC, BigXII, PAC12 or Big West.


I respectfully disagree with this. I think there are a lot of players like Tim Tebow who are going to places like Florida, Ohio state, texas and OK because they are in a major conference with a shot at a NC. If BYU got into a conference like the Big 12 and showed we were capable of competing there, these players would start giving BYU a harder look when being recruited. I think BYU's recruiting would improve substantially in a better conference. Even as an independant, BYU is getting looks from religious kids looking for a religious school, I think that with a better conference the talent level on the religious kids would also increase.
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Cougs_Rule
frdbtr wrote:
I'm a firm believer that BYU's recruiting is independent of BYU's affiliations. BYU recruits who they recruit. That's not going to change if BYU is in the MWC, WAC, WCC, BigXII, PAC12 or Big West.


I think that with a better conference the talent level on the religious kids would also increase.


Like I said, a wing and a big prayer.
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imuakahuku
I don't get the thought that we would be in the middle to bottom of the B12. If we joined we would most likely end up in the North division.



Those teams in the division would most likely include:

Kansas - very weak

KState - weak

Iowa St. - very weak

Lou - weak to ok

WV - strong to decent

BYU - better than most if not all these teams (save WV) year in and year out.



South would most likely be:

Tx

TT

OK

OK state

Baylor

TCU



We would play most likely three of the teams in the south and all the North teams. So factor in 3 gimmee's from OOC and one middle of the road challenge OOC (e.g. Navy, Purdue, and the like), and four from the South and we are at 8 wins. Beat WV and get 9 wins. Take one of three from the south get to 10 wins and playing in the conf championship game. Upset (most years would be an upset) that team and we are in a "BCS" bowl and maybe in a playoff for NC. Can't to that right now (even if undefeated). Personally I would prefer to be playing in the Big 12 championship game ever two to three years than getting a few good games and playing several scrubs. We have good schedules for the next couple years but what happens when the rest of the BIG conferences make rules banning any non-september OOC games?



I for one hope we get in to the BIG 12 North because I can see us dominating it almost like the MWC and the WAC. WV would be the only true competition year in and year out. The rest are good sometimes but weak most of the time. If we got put in the South that would be a different story, but I doubt that would happen because that would mean putting TCU in the North which I doubt the Texas teams would go for, because having TCU play in the championship every year would eat into their recruiting.



So in my judgement I say BRING ON THE B12!!!!
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frdbtr
dmcougar wrote:
SpiffCoug wrote:
I'm a firm believer that BYU's recruiting is independent of BYU's affiliations. BYU recruits who they recruit. That's not going to change if BYU is in the MWC, WAC, WCC, BigXII, PAC12 or Big West.


I think that with a better conference the talent level on the religious kids would also increase.


Like I said, a wing and a big prayer.


It is not a wing and a prayer. If you look at the statistics of programs before and after BCS conference invites, they significantly improved in recruiting. I read one person who showed that Louisville's recruiting went from 1.5 star average to 3.5 star average. Look at what utah's recruiting did in one year, they had the best recruiting class ever this last year. It is not a wing and a prayer, it is verifiable fact.
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imuakahuku
Another thing to contemplate is that bball players like Jabari might be much more inclined to go to BYU since it would be a seriously strong conference. It would be the second or third strongest most years. Go .500 in conference and probably get a ticket to the Dance. BTW they don't do N and S for bball. Imagine the bball games every year, Kansas, Kstate, Baylor, Texas, OK state, WV, Iowa St. That is some pretty tough competition and some pretty awesome matchups!
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Lawboy
I have heard many people that BYU's destiny is toed to ND, and I have always HATED that. I still do. But, it is means what has been speculated, then I am ok with it--for now.



This is so far out of BYU's control right now though. They are at the whim of the league and its TV contract, and that desire to expand to 12 or 14 teams. And it all revolves around what Clemson and FSU might do? Which then would trigger ND to move? So if CLemson and FSU stay put, things change again, because ND would have little reason to jump.



It could all get crazy again in the next 4-8 weeks. But at least it will not be mid-season like last time.
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Cougs_Rule
Imua, look at those alignments one more time. What seems clear and obvious is the disparity between the two. No way that stays that way. They would go East and West and divvy up the patsies.
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