Bad Team - Whadda U Think? Poll

Hawk and Mars and perhaps many others think Notre Dame is a bad team. One poster simulated the 2012 season showing BYU as a favorite to beat this bad team in South Bend. The Bibster felt like BYU would be the underdog in that one - based on what little he actually knows now about how things will look next October. He further stated that BYU chances would MAYBE be much less than 50% - meaning that if Riley Nelson gets injured and BYU has not had enough opportunity to get Lark or someone else ready - we may have almost no chance to win that game at that venue on that date.



Whadda U think? Explain your choice. Give your expected chances. Consider team depth and risk of injury to both teams as well as holes they have to fill and how well they recruited or how deep their pipeline was. You decide whether you think God will intervene and help his favorite team and which team you think is God's favorite team or if there is a God or if he has a favorite team or if he is a male.



The intent of this poll is not for you say what you wish it would be - it is to find out what you realistically expect it to be. Then perhaps we pull this poll out next October and we can all hold ourselves and each other accountable.



Sounds fun!



PS - I am from Utah, love Utah, wish I lived in Utah now, and would retire in Utah if my wife would let me. I graduated from BYU, have a son in BYU Law School having attended graduate and undergraduate business school at BYU. I just brough my youngest son home from BYU to submit his mission papers. I love BYU. First and foremost. Just in case you were wonderin.



2011 Notre Dame Fighting Irish Football Schedule

Final Record: 8-5





USF Bulls L 20-23

@Michigan Wolverines L 31-35

Michigan State Spartans W 31-13

@Pittsburgh Panthers W 15-12

@Purdue Boilermakers W 38-10

Air Force Falcons W 59-33

USC Trojans L 17-31

Navy Midshipmen W 56-14

@Wake Forest Demon Deacons W 24-17

Maryland Terrapins W 45-21

Boston College Eagles W 16-14

@Stanford Cardinal L 14-28



2011 Champs Sports Bowl

Florida State Seminoles Florida Citrus Bowl, Orlando, FL L 14-18



They are beatable. They are beatable at home - USC and USF beat them at home. BC, Maryland, Navy, Air Force, and Michigan State failed to beat them at home. On the road, Michigan and Stanford beat them. Wake Forest, Purdue, and Pittsburgh failed to beat them on the road.



Is ND a bad team? Assume the traditional meaning for the word BAD.

Let me start the bidding. ND is not a BAD team. They are not elite these days by any means. They are not BAD. They were pretty good last year. Too good to spot a home field advantage to and have BYU be favored to win.



iirc, if you go back another year, Utah beat us in 2010 after losing to ND in South Bend.



Look at that schedule folks. No 40 point losses at home or on the road. Consider the last two times we played Florida State. ND lost in a Bowl Game in Florida by 4 points. Consider how BYU did against ranked teams last year or ever.



Sure ND lost to USC at home(projected 2012 NC by many), Stanford in California, Florida State in Florida, and, yes - South Florida at home by 2 points in the season opener, and early at Michigan in front of about 100,000 screaming fans by 4 points. FIve losses. Eight wins. No amazing wins. Several solid wins.



BYU best win - Tulsa

ND best win - IDK several candidates

I vote that using "U" instead of the word "you" for every thread U make is uncalled for and shows Ur TRUE COLORS.



;)

Notre Dame's recruiting classes:

2006- #8

2007- #8

2008- #2

2009- #21

2010- #14

2011- #10

2012- #22



Notre Dame is above average on the field, but if we're talking performance vs. reasonable expectations, you could do worse than to call them "bad." When you've had twice as many coaches in 12 years as BYU has had in the last 40, your program has issues.

I think they are on the upswing--they have the best coach they have had since Davies/Willingham, and Kelly might prove to be better than them both. But it's gonna take a while to straighten things out there.

BlueIsBetter wrote:
I vote that using "U" instead of the word "you" for every thread U make is uncalled for and shows Ur TRUE COLORS.



;)

I will take that under advisement, but can I still use iirc, lmao, lmfao, and yafj?



[ Post made via Mobile Device ] http://cougarcorner.com/images/mobile.png" alt="" loading="lazy" style="max-width:100%">

How many games does BYU win last year with ND's schedule? Is BYU a bad team?



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Larrycoug wrote:
How many games does BYU win last year with ND's schedule? Is BYU a bad team?



[ Post made via Mobile Device ] http://cougarcorner.com/images/mobile.png" alt="" loading="lazy" style="max-width:100%">

Bingo! +1.

Larrycoug wrote:
How many games does BYU win last year with ND's schedule? Is BYU a bad team?



[ Post made via Mobile Device ] http://cougarcorner.com/images/mobile.png" alt="" loading="lazy" style="max-width:100%">

Probably 8, right? I don't think last year's team would've beaten Michigan State, but no way do we lose to USF. How many non-bowling teams have we lost to in in the last 7 years? There's a fair number of bad BE/ACC teams on that schedule (BC, Pitt, Maryland). I still think we'd beat Purdue, AFA and WF.



But I think the issue people have with ND is that a) last year's 8-win season is their best since 2006, and b) Notre Dame recruits at a level substantially higher than 92.5% of college football, much less BYU.

Suggest replacing "bad" team with "underachieving or not meeting expectations". ND should have a better record than the Y each year based strictly upon their recruiting class. However, they have been team dysfunctional with the revolving coaches and QB door. A good majority of their QBs have come into the program but don't pan out. They are generally given a free pass with preliminary pre-season rankings just because they are ND. While not a bad team, they can be very inconsistent - Not sure which team will show up foe the game.



If we received the kind of recruiting class that they do every year but applied our elevated standards to what Bronco requires of recruits, I believe that the Y would have a better record than they do because Bronco extracts the most out if his talent level.



If we protect Riley - which our OL didn't do very well last year (note he wasn't hurt running but getting hit during or after passes), as well as establish a runnin game, and shut down their running game, we will beat this years ND team.



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BYU C1



I agree that ND underachieves relative to their recruiting class hype. Part of it is schedule. And although BEAST teams are not exactly Beasts, but BYU fans need to remember the last time we played one. BC comes to mind. Spoiled our season. OK we beat Pitt in 1984 - a really bad Putt team with our NC team. It was a close game BTW.



When we start going undefeated vs BEAST we can diss ND.



Overhyped - yes. Underachievers - yes. Bad - no.



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OK - I checked some facts



ND losses to 3 top 15 BCS Poll final ranking teams is nothing to be embarrassed about. ND was competitive with Michigan at #13, Stanfordat #4, and USC who deserved to be right by Stanford. Ok technically USC was not ranked in the BCS Poll due to probation, but at least one major poll had them in Top 10 and several have them as 2012 NC favorites. Oh and then the loss to #28 Florida State in the Bowl game. BYU would likely have lost all four of those games.



That USF loss at home is one loss that gives hope as USF was ranked well behind us and well behind the three teams that beat us and behind Tulsa, whom we beat. That is our glimmer of hope.



Our best win was Tulsa followed by USU. ND's best win would have to be #17 Michigan State. They beat several tems ranked ahead of Tulsa and Utah State. We were pummeled by Utah. ND was not pummeled by anyone.



ND was ranked ahead of BYU in the poll, although only 2 spots ahead. Both teams were Top 35 in the final poll.



If ND is a bad team. By any comparison, that would make BYU a worse team.



When a worse team plays a same or better tem on the road, the odds of winning are less than 50% - maybe much less considering potential injuries at that point in the season and relative depth of the two opponents.



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What does all of this mean?

Some may be wondering if The Bibster is Irish. Is the Pope Catholic? Yes! Is The Bibster Irish. No. Flip no.



It means Manti Teo went to ND to play the best teams anywhere, anytime. Made a name for himself. Probably did not like losing so many games. Team never got much recognition in the end despite annual hype.



The Bibster tries not to hate any teams. The Bibster lived in Chicago twice. The Bibster became fond of underdogs like Northwestern when he lived and worked in Evanston and UI - the butt of the best joke in the movie Risky Business filmed on North Shore of Lake Michigan.



He got really tired of how ND, OSU, and UM fans at work acted like BYU did not even exist. If The Bibster ever were to start hating teams - these would be three candidates. I am not a fan. I do respect them.



I want BYU to pull the Upset and beat ND in South Bend. And yes - The Bibster has been to a game in that storied stadium - Chicago Bears, though - not ND. You cannot get tickets to ND games. ND has an amazing fan base.



[ Post made via Mobile Device ] http://cougarcorner.com/images/mobile.png" alt="" loading="lazy" style="max-width:100%">

I think Notre Dame was a pretty good team last year. The 2011 Irish beat Michigan State (AP Final #11) as well as bowl teams Pitt, Purdue, Air Force, and Wake Forrest, and lost to USC (#6), Stanford (#7), Michigan (#12), Florida State (#23), and South Florida (unranked).



BYU only beat two bowl teams Tulsa and Utah State, and they lost to Texas (unranked), Utah (unranked), and TCU (#14). If BYU played Notre Dame's schedule (with Nelson at QB), I think they go 7-6 or 6-7 with losses to Michigan State, Michigan, Stanford, USC, Florida State and possible losses at Purdue and at Wake.



My impression is that Notre Dame will improve over last year's performance, so I'd say Notre Dame are 7 point favorites at home versus BYU. The best thing that BYU has going for them is that they are sandwiched between Stanford and Oklahoma on ND's schedule, so they might be overlooked.

Cougarbib2 wrote:
He got really tired of how ND, OSU, and UM fans at work acted like BYU did not even exist. If The Bibster ever were to start hating teams - these would be three candidates. I am not a fan. I do respect them.

I don't mind Notre Dame fans, but Michigan, Ohio State, Wisconsin, and Iowa fans are intolerable.



I know all of my ND alum friends/coworkers view BYU as a worthy opponent. I may be wrong on this, but ND is the only team in the entire Big Ten footprint that BYU has scheduled in the past 15 years. Part of the reason Big Ten fans act like BYU doesn't exist is BYU because BYU rarely schedules Big Ten teams--I think the last opponent BYU scheduled was Penn State in 1992.

Mingjai wrote:

He got really tired of how ND, OSU, and UM fans at work acted like BYU did not even exist. If The Bibster ever were to start hating teams - these would be three candidates. I am not a fan. I do respect them.

I don't mind Notre Dame fans, but Michigan, Ohio State, Wisconsin, and Iowa fans are intolerable.



I know all of my ND alum friends/coworkers view BYU as a worthy opponent. I may be wrong on this, but ND is the only team in the entire Big Ten footprint that BYU has scheduled in the past 15 years. Part of the reason Big Ten fans act like BYU doesn't exist is BYU because BYU rarely schedules Big Ten teams--I think the last opponent BYU scheduled was Penn State in 1992.

I think ND fans generally are more respectful of opponents and now is better than 1980s when I lived there. Maybe Danny Ainge got their attention.



We have played a few Big 10 teams - usually in Bowl games since they will not usually schedule us - and it usually reinforced their arrogance. Indiana, 6-5 Michigan, Penn State a couple of times, Ohio State three times, Iowa, maybe Purdue, Missouri when still Big 12 come to mind. Out of all that we got 2 or so wins and a tie. And we went 1-2 or so vs ND with a win over a bad ND team.



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Cougarbib2 wrote:
We have played a few Big 10 teams - usually in Bowl games since they will not usually schedule us - and it usually reinforced their arrogance.

I wonder if Big Ten teams don't want to schedule BYU or if BYU hasn't really tried to schedule Big Ten teams or both. I know many Big Ten teams like to schedule MAC teams because MAC teams usually represent an easy win while still drawing decent attendance as the MAC teams fans can travel to the game.



I'd like to see BYU get on some of the mid-tier Big Ten teams schedules--Iowa, Northwestern, Illinois, Purdue, etc.

Chicago is a good trip. North Shore area near and beyond Northwestern is beautiful. NW is a class institution IMHO and are not Big 10 Arrogant like some Big 10 teams.



When I lived there Utah came to town and beat them about 40 to zip iirc. They have improved and had a nice flash about a decade ago.



IDK if they are willing to risk adding us to a schedule they already struggle to compete against.



Home and Away. I would support that as an on-going series.



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Anyone else concerned that possibly the best hardest hitting lb in the country might have a grudge with BYU, and we have an injury proned QB that likes to tuck and run?



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Larrycoug wrote:
Anyone else concerned that possibly the best hardest hitting lb in the country might have a grudge with BYU, and we have an injury proned QB that likes to tuck and run?



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Not really.