Does Utah struggling in the Pac-12 make you nervous?

BYU has more pac-12 wins than Utah does. Yes Utah destroyed us, but they've done nothing the rest of the year and while we got to rest our guys against Idaho St. They were busy getting lit up by Cal.



No rest for the weary in the BCS.



Love them or hate them, most of us thought Utah fields some pretty good teams. They've obviously had some major injuries this year, but who's to say that won't be us in a BCS conference either. You've got to be looking at Utah's struggles and asking whether or not we'd be okay with 0-4 in the big-12 right now, or if you'd prefer going 6-2 and bowl eligible this year.



Frankly, I had a lot of fun watching our guys beat up on idaho State.

I'm glad you brought this up.



First off, talking specifically about the Utes, I just can't wrap my head around how bad they've been. I don't really like the Utes, but there's a point where schadenfreude stops being fun, and for me that was tonight. They should be playing better than this. I suspect Hays deserves a lot of the blame, but there's just no swagger anywhere. I think they had the misfortune of playing their 3 hardest conference games at the beginning of the season, and now they're buying into the notion that they're not good enough. I think deep down, we all know the Utes aren't this bad, just as we know that BYU isn't really 43 points worse than they are. (Or maybe they are that bad with Hays under center. I just know that the healthy, season-opening Utes could beat at least Wazzu, Colorado, and UCLA, and wouldn't get blown out by a team like Cal.)



Separately from the Utes, I worry about the Big 12 if things go in that direction, because the Big 12 is (IMO) a much better conference than the Pac-12 from top to bottom. This year, at least, Kansas is the only truly awful "no way you lose to those guys" sort of team in the Big XII. ISU and Mizzou are pretty bad, but they've still shown more flashes of toughness than the Pac's doormats. When conference play only provides you one "gimme" game, things can get pretty tough week in and week out. It is a surprisingly "up" year for the Big XII, though.



Having said that, though, I slightly disagree with your sentiment about this season. I like FCS blowouts just fine, but I don't take too much pride in our 6-2. I'm not as down on the Cougars as much as a lot of fans are, and I'm having plenty of fun rooting for our team, but this isn't the stuff you make legacies out of. Our schedules should be tougher than this.



But I'm tired of the speculation about the Big XII. If the fates conspire and it happens, awesome. Until then, I'm pumped for our 2012 and 2013 schedules, which I think are actually a good mix of challenge and comfort.

Either you are misinformed about what kind of schedule BYU played back in the day when they created their legacy - or ou don't think BYU has much of a legacy. They were in the WAC for heaven's sakes and that was before the WAC strengthened. Then they graduated to the MWC. That was where the legacy was made. And yes, every decade or two, they beat a team that finsihed in the Top 15. That is the reality.



Miami was a very good team when Detmer beat them in Provo.



Kansas State was a very good team when Sarkisian beat them in the Cotton Bowl - our only New Years Day Bowl appearance.



AirForce was a Top 10 team once when we beat them.



We tied a very good Iowa team in the Holiday Bowl



After that - slippery slope if you are looking for wins over really good teams. Yes we have some recent things like a win over a down Oklahoma team and a near win vs a down Texas team. Yes, we beat a 6-6 Micigan team in the National Championship game.



We have wins over bad Texas, Oklahoma, ND, Washington, UCLA, etc., teams.



We beat a decent Oregon team in the Las Vegas Bowl but not a great one. We beat a decent A&M team.



I may have missed one - but that is about it in the 40+years I have been watching.



We have wins like Arizona and loses to same. ASU - same. But we have more losses than wins to what are today BCS teams.



It is all in the record book. Remind me of what other wins you would wan tto quible about and how many teams of that nature we beat in any one season.

In a word - H e cc K Yes

The really unfortunate thing for the Utes is that they made the jump to the Pac 12 in the wrong year for their program. This is their worst team, talent wise, since before Urban Meyer came, and that was before the injuries. They also went through a scheme change on offense, and tried to implement it with their starting quarterback not being able to take all of the reps needed because of injury/illness.

Nope!



I'm loving it. It keeps their fans on the down low. Usually they would still be gloating over their beat down of us, but they are too busy eating humble pie to gloat



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It should for those who are so in lust with Big 12 memberhship that they overlook the high probabability that our average record every year will be 7-5.

That said, have to consider the qb context. KWhitt killed himself when he selfishly took one or two of his best athletes who were qb's and put them on D (inless they really stunk at qb). Take that big and fairly fast safety (blechen?) And he could run a tebow offense) and do better than what they have. We see what a bad qb can do to a whole team.



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It is a look at reality in a BCS conference. I know for years Utah and BYU have said we all deserved to play in a BCS level conference as the big boys of the non-AQ, but while it was true that we did deserve that access, the reality is what Utah is living that life in a BCS conference is a lot different from life in the MWC or WAC. Reality was always looking at Arizona and Arizona State that came from the WAC some time ago, but never dominated to the level they did in the WAC.



What will be interesting is to see the impact over time if BYU does join the Big 12. Will we actually be able to land a higher percentage of top tier LDS tallent that we have missed? I think if we can, then that is what will make us be more often at the top end of a BCS conference or otherwise we're looking at a lot of seasons where our objective is to make sure we're at least in a bowl game. Utah is living reality, but even if they were in the MWC this year, I still believe they would only be the third best team. The MWC though this year has a very, very ugly bottem end.

stuckinbig10country wrote:
The really unfortunate thing for the Utes is that they made the jump to the Pac 12 in the wrong year for their program. This is their worst team, talent wise, since before Urban Meyer came, and that was before the injuries. They also went through a scheme change on offense, and tried to implement it with their starting quarterback not being able to take all of the reps needed because of injury/illness.

This.



While there was never a bad time for the Utes to jump to the PAC, there could have been better years, talent wise. They have a decent defense. Their offense is just as bad as it was last year. I think people are reading too much into the BYU-Utah game. It was one bad game. Anyone here think they beat us 54-10 ten times in a row? Didn't think so.



Sure if BYU goes to the Big 12, we will not have as many 10 win seasons. As a BYU fan, I would be happy if we were bowl eligible most years, competed for the conference championship every 4-5 years and came away with a conference championship every decade. That would equal greater success than 75% of the current BCS programs, who never sniff a BCS bowl. The trade off for all the 10 win seasons would be intriguing games each week in LES. Each game at LES during league play would be more interesting and more fun than the game we would get in the Armed Forces bowl each year after a 10 win season.

utah's struggles in the pac 12 this year says more about utah then it does the pac 12. They are a doormat pac 12 team this year and we should have never lost to them. Unfortunately, we weren't prepared well for that game and gave it away on turnovers. If BYU was playing utah's schedule, we would not be 0-4 in the pac right now. Just watch, next week Oregon state is going to put up 50 on them and utah will be lucky to score 10. This is a team that we went to corvalis and handled easily.

ABYUFAN wrote:
Nope!



I'm loving it. It keeps their fans on the down low. Usually they would still be gloating over their beat down of us, but they are too busy eating humble pie to gloat



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I'm with you here. The Pukes struggling NEVER makes me nervous.



One comment: I recall the year ASU and AU bolted for the Pac-8. They had been dominating in the WAC up till then. It took them around five years or so so get competitive in the Pac-10. I think that is to be expected. If we go Big XII, it gonna be a few years before we can stand toe-to-toe with them. But after that, the struggles will just be memories and we will be looking at a much better Cougar team.

No. I have said it all year, the Utes have a bad team.



we don't turn the ball over 7 times to them, and give up halfway, we win that game.



We were in that game 14-10 at the galf, despite giving the ball up something like 5 times, and missing a gimme field goal.



In any of our 11-2 years we would gone at least 8-4 in the big 12.

BlueIsBetter wrote:

We were in that game 14-10 before the gaffe,

fixed it for you

Utah is a good team with major QB issues. Any Utah team the past five years does well in the PAC. They have a solid D that gets tired late. They are in every game at half, but no O kills them. If Wynn was healthy they are 2-2 in the PAC.



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Lawboy wrote:
If Wynn was healthy they are 2-2 in the PAC.

I think 2-2 would be a strong possibility, but not a given. I do think, however, that with Wynn playing you don't have any serious worries missing the bowl cut.

The Utes are struggling because they have no QB. I'm with Lawboy, they wouldn't be this poor in the PAC12 if they'd gotten better QB play.

Better dead than red. I hope they lose every game they play and their football program gets shutdown.

Does it make me nervous? No. Does it make me happy? YES!

SpiffCoug wrote:
The Utes are struggling because they have no QB. I'm with Lawboy, they wouldn't be this poor in the PAC12 if they'd gotten better QB play.

And herein lies the challenge for a mid major stepping into BCS conference - depth. That is the issue. We would compete well with U even with them having Wynn with Riley Nelson now. But that week, Riley wasn't able to lift the boats more than an inch or two.



Same at other positions. We lose a step or two quickly in the 2-deep.



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Are you kidding - absolutely not. I have a lot of respect for Norm Chow and what he accomplished those many years ago at BYU. However, look at what he has done over the last few years at UCLA, USC, and now Utah. Jordan Wynn reminds him of Ty Detmer, really? Kyle Wittingham has already called the offense out on many occasions for under performing, being lethargic, etc. I recognize that the level of talent on the offensive side of the ball is less than in years past; however, I think that Norm Chow's time of greatness is over and he should retire.