The Impact of Riley on Offense

I think it is becoming clear that Riley is the spark that was missing our formerly listless offense. He not only is a fierce competitor but he inspires others to play well. Our OL is now dominating the DL by opening huge holes and not allowing sacks, our RBs are playing punishing football and not going down on first hit, and the WRs are making spectacular plays - Hoffman is taking it to another level.



Stats for OSU game:



Total Yards 499



Passing 217 - Nelson 17/27, 217 yards, 8.0 avg yds, 3 TDs, 1 INT



Rushing 282



Nelson 12-87, 7.3 avg., 22 longest run

Alisa 20-84, 4.2 avg., 1 TD, 10 longest run



Receiving



Hoffman 9-162; 18.0 avg. 1 TD, 46 longest catch

Falslev 3-18; 6.0 avg., 1 TD, 11 longest catch



3rd Down Conversions 11-14



Time of Possession 33:36 to OSU 26:24



It appears that we are continuing to make improvements - should be ready for TCU if the improvement continues.

The first four games, the most yards BYU had in a game was 354 against Utah. The fewest we've had the last three games is 443.

Just another quick thought. Our team is beginning to find out its true identity. The DL/LB are taking on the image of being hard hitting, tough as nails to run on, and this is mirrored by the attitude of our QB Nelson who is firing up the offense to be a juggernaut. I personally believe that Nelson has helped infuse this attitude throughout the team.

Attitude is contagious.

SpiffCoug wrote:
The first four games, the most yards BYU had in a game was 354 against Utah. The fewest we've had the last three games is 443.

We are also playing teams that aren't very good. SJSU and a 1&5 OSU team are not Ole Miss, Texas & and the yewts. Let's not forget to factor that into the equation.



I am mostly happy with Riley, but I feel for Heaps having to play the toughest part of the schedule and then watching everyone sing Riley's praises for beating up on lesser competition.



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crh55 wrote:

The first four games, the most yards BYU had in a game was 354 against Utah. The fewest we've had the last three games is 443.

We are also playing teams that aren't very good. SJSU and a 1&5 OSU team are not Ole Miss, Texas & and the yewts. Let's not forget to factor that into the equation.



I am mostly happy with Riley, but I feel for Heaps having to play the toughest part of the schedule and then watching everyone sing Riley's praises for beating up on lesser competition.



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It's interesting that Greg Wrubell brought this up on the postgame show today. It is his opinion that there is very little difference between the teams that Heaps played against versus the teams that Nelson has played. Right now it's not really worth comparing them. The good thing is the BYU team is finally starting to roll again, where as before we couldn't.

I will say, I am happy the vertical game is still present with Riley at the helm. He had some nice shots down field. That was one of the biggest concerns I had with Riley being named the starter. The offense is making more big plays nowadays.



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crh55 wrote:

The first four games, the most yards BYU had in a game was 354 against Utah. The fewest we've had the last three games is 443.

We are also playing teams that aren't very good. SJSU and a 1&5 OSU team are not Ole Miss, Texas & and the yewts. Let's not forget to factor that into the equation.



I am mostly happy with Riley, but I feel for Heaps having to play the toughest part of the schedule and then watching everyone sing Riley's praises for beating up on lesser competition.



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Well - go back and look at Jakes PER last year when he let Riley take the brunt of UW, AFA, and early FSU, before playing mostly cupcakes himself the rest of the way. Go look at that PER - game by game for any opponents you think are similar. Ole MIss, Texas, Utah, UCF, are not ranked unless Texas survives this week's rankings. Or just take the USU game. That should tell you everything you need to know. I would guess that you are one of the posters after that game that posted that it was a fluke becasue USU didn't get to game plan for Riley and that he would soon be humbled. But that did not happen - did it? Try to let these things give you solace. But hang tight. Next week will not satisfy you either. That is an opponent that we will all be able to agree is an absolute cupcake. But all of the others - except maybe Texas and U - all about the same.

hawkwing wrote:

SpiffCoug wrote:
The first four games, the most yards BYU had in a game was 354 against Utah. The fewest we've had the last three games is 443.

We are also playing teams that aren't very good. SJSU and a 1&5 OSU team are not Ole Miss, Texas & and the yewts. Let's not forget to factor that into the equation.



I am mostly happy with Riley, but I feel for Heaps having to play the toughest part of the schedule and then watching everyone sing Riley's praises for beating up on lesser competition.



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It's interesting that Greg Wrubell brought this up on the postgame show today. It is his opinion that there is very little difference between the teams that Heaps played against versus the teams that Nelson has played. Right now it's not really worth comparing them. The good thing is the BYU team is finally starting to roll again, where as before we couldn't.

Reminds me of a Rising Tide ;)



A former BYU QB - KSL Color man - I know he is a nobody - but probably had a higher PER than Jake Heaps - explained what is wrong with Jake quite politely - he did not come right out and say Jake plays scared.



He said that Jake rushes his throws before it is necessary to throw and thus the route has not had time to develop and the receiver has not had time to separate - thus Jake tries to laser a pin-

point pass to a covered receiver, and throws a hard pass that arrives before the receiver is ready to catch it.



Add to that - Bronco said that what Riley brings is the ability to buy time and improvise when receivers are not open giving recievers time to adjust their routes and that it is much more difficult to defend adjusted routes. He said it has made us more difficult to defend.



And then of course Riley can pop 50-80 yards rushing per game - not sure he even gets any credit for that in his PER.



Maybe Spiff can answer this - but is a 160 PER QB that rushed for 80 yards better than a 160 PER QB that had -20 yards in sacks. Is that 100 yard difference facotored into PER?

Actually, Marc Lyons is the only quarterback who has throw at least 500 passes who has a worse career PER than Heaps. (110.17 vs 99.81).



PER doesn't factor in QB rushing yards. In 2007, Hall had a 205.73 PER with -18 rushing. The next week he had a 120.27 PER with 28 rushing. In 2008, Hall had a 97.66 PER with -24 rushing followed by a 186.39 PER with 28 rushing.

I am actually getting sick of the "riley is only playing well because we are playing cupcakes right now" crowd. The bottom line is, Riley is marching our offense up and down the field running the offense the way it is designed and that is why he is playing and Jake heaps is not. The level of competition has not changed much since he has taken over. USU played Jake Heaps better then utah did as far as the passing game goes and Oregon state is every bit as good as Ole miss was. If the only reason we are playing well now is because level of competition, why haven't the coaches put Jake back in? He obviously outshines Riley in practice, wouldn't it be reasonable to assume that he would come in and tear up this "weak" competition? Well, the bottom line is, he wasn't getting it done in games and Riley does.



One last thought, I hope we can put the "weak arm" argument to bed once and for all. Riley is throwing a better deap ball then Jake did all year. That throw to Hoffman in stride after stepping out of a sack was beautiful and was the best deap throw of the year. Those of you saying that Riley has the weakest arm out of all of the QB's that have ever been to BYU have forgotten how weak Ty detmer's arm was. In fact Riley's throws have every bit as much zip as Max hall's passes did. He doesn't have a Jake Heaps or John Beck arm but he can and does make every throw that is neccessary in this offense.

SpiffCoug wrote:
Actually, Marc Lyons is the only quarterback who has throw at least 500 passes who has a worse career PER than Heaps. (110.17 vs 99.81).



PER doesn't factor in QB rushing yards. In 2007, Hall had a 205.73 PER with -18 rushing. The next week he had a 120.27 PER with 28 rushing. In 2008, Hall had a 97.66 PER with -24 rushing followed by a 186.39 PER with 28 rushing.

Spiff, does spiking the ball to stop the clock get figured in to PER? Riley spiked the ball twice in the 1st half to stop the clock, and that gets counted as an incomplete.

Admittedly, I was a Nelson skeptic, and a Heaps supporter. I have humbly repented of my errors.



1. First, it does not matter the level of competition, the QB still has to deliver the ball where the receiver can catch it, Heaps was awful in that regard, and I don't know why.



2. Second, even if Heaps is not a scrambler and a runner, he can still move around in the pocket and buy himself time, he can step up in the pocket, he can move out--but he never did any of that, so we either got a badly thrown ball or a sack.



3. Third, Nelson buys time and gives the receivers time to get open. Hoffman stated this fact in his interview yesterday. nelson forces the DBs to cover longer, and our receivers are good enough they can't do that.



4. Fourth, the most glaring difference between Heaps and Nelson, is the third down conversion percentage. Nelson gets those third downs converted, Heaps did not, thus we move the chains, we gain field position, we keep the football (1 punt in three games with Nelson), we score points. I am certain the coaches look at this one fact and know Nelson is going to be the QB for the rest of the season...and maybe next.



This raises a very interesting question about Heaps, what is he going to do? is he done at BYU? will he transfer? is he the backup next year...again? can he win the starting job back? I think Heaps is done. For whatever reasons, he is not able to perform well in games, he cannot convert third downs, Nelson can; he cannot get the ball to the receivers, Nelson can; Heaps cannot throw TD passes, Nelson can.



So I think the notion that heaps is our QB through 2013 is out the window, and the new QBs coming in next fall can look at Nelson as a senior and know they can be the starter in 2013 or 2014. They will also see that perhaps in college football today, you must be mobile, at least some, it is certainly an advantage in the real game.

golong wrote:



This raises a very interesting question about Heaps, what is he going to do? is he done at BYU? will he transfer? is he the backup next year...again? can he win the starting job back? I think Heaps is done. For whatever reasons, he is not able to perform well in games, he cannot convert third downs, Nelson can; he cannot get the ball to the receivers, Nelson can; Heaps cannot throw TD passes, Nelson can.



So I think the notion that heaps is our QB through 2013 is out the window, and the new QBs coming in next fall can look at Nelson as a senior and know they can be the starter in 2013 or 2014. They will also see that perhaps in college football today, you must be mobile, at least some, it is certainly an advantage in the real game.

If Jake is smart he will stick around and wait till Riley inevitably gets hurt, or Redshirt and give himself 2 more years of post Riley eligibility. I still think he has huge upside and this "time out" could serve him well. Hopefully he doesn't transfer and pull a Ben Olson and fade into nothing.



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golong wrote:
This raises a very interesting question about Heaps, what is he going to do? is he done at BYU? will he transfer? is he the backup next year...again? can he win the starting job back? I think Heaps is done. For whatever reasons, he is not able to perform well in games, he cannot convert third downs, Nelson can; he cannot get the ball to the receivers, Nelson can; Heaps cannot throw TD passes, Nelson can.



So I think the notion that heaps is our QB through 2013 is out the window, and the new QBs coming in next fall can look at Nelson as a senior and know they can be the starter in 2013 or 2014. They will also see that perhaps in college football today, you must be mobile, at least some, it is certainly an advantage in the real game.

I want him to redshirt next year and then compete for the starting job after Riley graduates. He needs to run the scout team for a year without a green jersey on.

RN is better vs inferior opponents--Just like JH was last year. How he performs vs a superior team such as TCU will be a good test. Not buying the whole OSU is as good as Texas spin. thats crap.

RN is clearly the better of the two QB's this year. This offense is starting to hum. Could have easily been a 40 to 50 point game with all of OSU's turnovers. We did not capitalize as we could have.

I hope the O continues to gain inertia and we go in and beat TCU as well.

Who knows what will happen to jake. I am convinced by some of you that he needs to be redshirted next year. And he better find a scrambling gear, bc our Oline cannot hold a pocket for very long and that is a big reason why RN has become so effective, in addition to a much improved running game with Alisa.

BUt could RN actually lead us to a near undefeated season next year? Or a BCS run? looking alot more likely than Jake.

crh55 wrote:

This raises a very interesting question about Heaps, what is he going to do? is he done at BYU? will he transfer? is he the backup next year...again? can he win the starting job back? I think Heaps is done. For whatever reasons, he is not able to perform well in games, he cannot convert third downs, Nelson can; he cannot get the ball to the receivers, Nelson can; Heaps cannot throw TD passes, Nelson can.



So I think the notion that heaps is our QB through 2013 is out the window, and the new QBs coming in next fall can look at Nelson as a senior and know they can be the starter in 2013 or 2014. They will also see that perhaps in college football today, you must be mobile, at least some, it is certainly an advantage in the real game.

If Jake is smart he will stick around and wait till Riley inevitably gets hurt, or Redshirt and give himself 2 more years of post Riley eligibility. I still think he has huge upside and this "time out" could serve him well. Hopefully he doesn't transfer and pull a Ben Olson and fade into nothing.



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If Jake does "pull a Ben Olsen" I think the results will be the same--no NFL attracting performances.

Then again, Jake needs NOW to be taking notes and watching RN lay it all out there and how to get in guys faces after they smack your helmet off--ala Ty Detmer. And jake needs to be taking notes, bc if Riley goes down with all his heriocs, we could be back to square one.

Idaho State couldnt come at a better time. We have injured that need rest. We have a backup qb situation that needs alot of help--NOW!! Either get Jake in to exemplify, yes I said exemplify, RN, at least in toughness, OR get in Lark.

BUt if Bronco buries his head in the sand and doesnt take the second half to better develop a qb, RILEY's IMPACT could die with one solid impact from Tank Carder at TCU, who you know will be gunning for Riley's head.

vancouvercougar wrote:

Actually, Marc Lyons is the only quarterback who has throw at least 500 passes who has a worse career PER than Heaps. (110.17 vs 99.81).



PER doesn't factor in QB rushing yards. In 2007, Hall had a 205.73 PER with -18 rushing. The next week he had a 120.27 PER with 28 rushing. In 2008, Hall had a 97.66 PER with -24 rushing followed by a 186.39 PER with 28 rushing.

Spiff, does spiking the ball to stop the clock get figured in to PER? Riley spiked the ball twice in the 1st half to stop the clock, and that gets counted as an incomplete.

No, those are counted as "team incompletions." Similarly, kneel downs at the end of the game count as "team rushes" and don't count against whomever kneels down.

Nelson can and is throwing the ball well, well over 10 yards. It's amazing how success changes minds.



As far as Heaps transfering, where would it be to. I think he has to prove himself here before anyone else will look at him. I truly hope that will happen.