Holmoe Exonerated - Big 12 Sunday Play and Exposure

Just in case this is true - anybody want to eat crow or offer an apology to a fine man? Just in case it is true! Sign up here. Wanna rethink Big East West? Indy looking a little more acceptable?





http://www.sltrib.com/sltrib/cougars/52718156-88/byu-television-conference-league.html.csp" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;



Nobody ever seems to get the benefit of the doubt.

Exonerated why exactly? The article woudl explain the reason we don't have a Big 12 invitaton, but it doesn't explain if there is no offer on the table why BYU can man up and say it appears there was not a mutual agreement to "pursue", not turndown or not admit that no offer was actually made, but stand up for what you believe.



So I don't have to write my other post again, since it relates to this thread:



Finally some more substanative answers or confirmation. I know it's not "official", but I wanted to know what was going on and Jay Drew gets about the deepest we have been able to get. My only question would be if that article is true, and it is easy to believe that BYU fell out of favor for 1) Sunday play issue; 2) national exposure & 3) the right to broadcast non-covered games; why no official response from BYU. If we're off the table, then dang it, tell the world that those things are that important to the head of the school/Church. We don't seem to beat around the bush about what we believe, so are they affraid to call a spade a spade? What benefit do they get from pissing off a huge segment of fans by being mute on the subject?



Arnett brought up a very insightful thought this week in his newsletter. He noted that he had checked on where the middle of the pack of the Big 12 was as far as having their games televised (realistically understanding that BYU wouldn't be conference champions every year as we were used to in WAC/MWC). What he found was that if your name wasn't Texas or Oklahoma, then you probably had your game televised under the 3rd tier portion of their conference coverage, meaning that your game was sold and picked up locally to the school, but if you lived elsewhere in the US, you could be SOL. I don't know if he studied it out completely to see for certain if their games were at least part of the ESPN additional college football package you could purchase, but under that scenario, if BYUtv wasn't in the picture for BYU, there could possibly be a whole lot of games not available to be seen if you didn't live in Utah. I would believe that is a DANG valid reason.



Maybe BYU has a point and they still feel they can get the independent schedule to improve. Bronco made it plain earlier this week that in studying the situation, it seems obvious to him that the best access to the BCS bowls and NC is only through BCS affilitation, but maybe that's a more tangible brass ring (lobbying the BCS for a Notre Dame type agreement) we can grasp than ever being in a BCS conference if no network is going to want to NEVER have the opportunity to have any conference championships (mainly non-football) on Sundays.



I just want to know why TH and COS think that no communication is the optimum avenue to go in not telling us fans anything. Stand up and be counted. You did it for Brandon Davies, do it now. Maybe they're affraid of burning a bridge with ESPN/ABC.

ANd before a few more people blast Holmoe for not opening his mouth - do you think maybe he was trying to resolve it, maybe had a non-disclosure agreement - but more importantly - how do you think this announcment might go down with WCC, potential opponents we are trying to schedule, and others that have helped us.



Tom Holmoe or higher up:



BYU would like to announce that we have had an exciting flirtation with the Big 12 that got our fans all excited about dumping the lowly WCC and their crappy arenas for bigger and better things and being able to actually play a decent opponent in football in LES on occasion.



We tried like H E double C K to dump all of you bums, but in the end, our high principles and moral ground got in the way. They would not guarantee us favorable exposure and were going to make us play Basketball on Sundays or forfeit a chance to play for the Championship - given that the Championship game may get scheduled on a Sunday once very 7 years or so, and that we might by some miracle be in it maybe one in ten times, the possibility of having to forfeit the CCG once every 70 years or so was more than we could bear up under.



But we have our principles - and we want those of you who are unprincipled to know that we stood our ground and thus are quite a bit better than all of the rest of you.



PS we are looking to engage again in those home and away discussions with some of you that we quit returning calls to for a month, and fully intend to remain loyal partners to the WCC - little gyms not withstanding, and our partnership with ESPN who screwed us out of the BIg 12 - unless the Big East / West, PAC, or Big 10/12 come calling or The Big 12 gets raided again and gets desparate enough to take us next time.



Respectfully



Tom

I've always understood that BYU continues to have athletics because of the positive exposure it provides for the church. If two of the three concerns were Sunday play and nationwide exposure, I can see why parties other than TH (BoT, Cecil and crew, Church officials) would be hesitant to move forward.



I still think that BYU would get more exposure in the Big XII, but if there were cogs in the BYU administrative machine who thought otherwise, I can see why it would be an uphill battle.



If you think that the alleged reasons the deal fell apart are invalid or negotiable, I can see why you'd want to blame SOMEBODY. I just don't know why there seems to be a large consensus among some fans that Holmoe is the man to blame. It's not like he overslept the day the home-run terms of agreement were due.

For all those who want answers from Tom Holmoe...Have you considered that just maybe Big 12 talks have hit a snag but are ongoing? Yes, the Big 12 has stated that they are playing with 10 teams next year. Yes, the Big 12 has invited TCU, however, we don't know if negotiations are ongoing, ended, or if the Big 12 just announced no more invites as a powerplay in the negotiations or even if the negotiations never got off the ground because of the instability of the Big 12. All we have are rumors. Let's wait...A REALLY LONG TIME... and then, once the smoke has cleared, we can ask for answers. Maybe they will give them, maybe they should give them but they won't, maybe they shouldn't even then, but at least we need to give time for the whole process to be completed. Until then, it is not worth whining, pining, or opining further.

If the Big 12 didn't clear no Sunday play with their TV partners before inviting BYU then the invitation was never real to begin with and they were just jerking us all around, or they were incredibly naive and stupid and tried to enter an agreement before getting things in writing (sound familiar?)

hawkwing wrote:
If the Big 12 didn't clear no Sunday play with their TV partners before inviting BYU then the invitation was never real to begin with and they were just jerking us all around, or they were incredibly naive and stupid and tried to enter an agreement before getting things in writing (sound familiar?)

Amen! That says it all!

Tis article was absolute rubbish. Jay Drew cites "sources", and then references tweets, and an article by a Tulsa World columnist. None of which have a statement from either BYU, he Big XII, or any Big XII school. In other words, it is pure speculation.



The Big XII would not court BYU for near a year if Sunday play was an issue. BEcause it is not. IN the multi-million dollar deal, you do realize that the only Sunday play game that matters for revenue is the Big XII hops tourney--and it is on Saturday now. So 1 game is the hold up? REally? Nt even buying that for a second.



THis article was Jay Drew pulling a GSwaim or a Chip Brown. It is nothing. Toilet paper, unless he gets an official statement.

The Big XII actually makes a little money on their women's basketball too, and that championship game is on Sunday.



I think when the Big XII needed a team, the conference and the TV partners were more willing to move some. Now they don't need it, so they can fire back a little in negotiations.

Another thing...I don't think many people blame Holmoe for this. Any fan of BYU knows that for the most part, the AD is just a figurehead, especially for decisions of this magnitude. This decision was always above his pay grade.

The bottom line is that BYU should not make any statement stating that they tried to leave the WCC and Independence unless they actually do it. Not if they expect people to contract games with us as an independent and not unless they want to already have made everyone in their new WCC conference despise them. You do not go out and publicly embarrass the WCC. You just don't.

This article BURNS Holmoe. It appears that the Big XII basically told him "We want BYU, but the Sunday thing puts you in a bad situation". To which he replies, "Well, we actually want a bunch of extra benefits too before we agree to join, stuff that not even Texas Tech gets". Bonehead.





"BYU — which left the Mountain West Conference for more national television exposure as a football independent — apparently wanted assurances from the Big 12 that it would appear on national television a minimum, unspecified, number of times per season. The Cougars also were said to want permission to show their football games not picked up by Big 12 television partners on their own television network, BYUtv, which is available in more than 60 million homes nationwide. Making the equal-access promise, as well as the provisions for BYUtv, was problematic for the television partners... Meanwhile, TCU didn’t ask for any concessions related to television broadcasting."



http://www.sltrib.com/sltrib/cougars/52718156-88/byu-television-conference-football.html.csp" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Mars wrote:


This article BURNS Holmoe. It appears that the Big XII basically told him "We want BYU, but the Sunday thing puts you in a bad situation". To which he replies, "Well, we actually want a bunch of extra benefits too before we agree to join, stuff that not even Texas Tech gets". Bonehead.





"BYU — which left the Mountain West Conference for more national television exposure as a football independent — apparently wanted assurances from the Big 12 that it would appear on national television a minimum, unspecified, number of times per season. The Cougars also were said to want permission to show their football games not picked up by Big 12 television partners on their own television network, BYUtv, which is available in more than 60 million homes nationwide. Making the equal-access promise, as well as the provisions for BYUtv, was problematic for the television partners... Meanwhile, TCU didn’t ask for any concessions related to television broadcasting."



http://www.sltrib.com/sltrib/cougars/52718156-88/byu-television-conference-football.html.csp" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

See takeaways thread and maybe it will help you and others better understand the true source of your anger

I don't think this article burns TH. The items BYU wanted were reasonable, if the Big 12 is not a good fit now, it might be in the futuer, meanwhile we're OK



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Yeah...get in and the rest will all work out, except that Sunday play thing...



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Mars wrote:

Yeah... get in and the rest will all work out, except that Sunday play thing...

Yeah, BYU has been talking to the Big XII for over a year now and Sunday play is the real issue here...



That, and they would force us to install a blue field.

There are reasons and excuses. PAC gave their reasons. Most of us saw those as excuses. Likewise Big 12 and / or it's media partners.



Take ESPN - what do you expect them to say - something like this:



Well we were in a pickle and the Big was in a pickle and BYU has a lot of Pickle Juice - and we were in such a pickle that we were about to cave in to all of their peculiarities like no Sunday Play, EXPOSURE and Fan ACCESS and all that stuff and really even had some guys willing to put hard feelings and prejudice about that Prop 8 stuff behind them - heck that is a California thing anyway - and even that one true religion stuff- all behind us and then- sheesh - Texas finally caved in and said they would agree to take TCU and bango - we not only saved the Big with an immediate A&M replacement - but h e cc k- now we got TCU on ESPN and we still have BYU to fill up weeknight spots.



But yeah we wanted them until it just became clearer and clearer how dang peculiar those people are.



Reasons. Excuses. You decide. And it could all change again tomorrow.



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BYU is mute and that's hard sometimes. When they come out with a "statement" it's just a backhand to fans faces.



BUT...



At least someone has swag in our athletic department. TH didn't get pushed around, he shoved them around and demanded a little more then new schools who are willing to do whatever it takes (looking at you utah, TCU, louisville).



Utah's case is very intersting, they sold their trust out for a non lucrative couple of years and barely get any TV time. TCU pays 5 mil to never play in the BE, and BS is the next B likely to go (ha suck it MWC).



Anyways, BYU wont give up what the viewers want. That's pretty neat. So while I think it's just a simple request (play games on BYUtv after nobody wants to air it, or rebroadcast older games) they didn't budge so TH said: Have a good day, peace.





Still what bugs me: I had to find this out through the SL trib. My tertiary source at the earliest.

This article does not exonerate byu in my opinion. If anything it supports the argument out there that byu overplayed its hand. i highly doubt sunday play was the sticking issue. my guess is that if we drop all the other conditions (certain number of national games guaranteed, tier three demands, and all the other demands) and only have sunday play as condition we would have been invited last week.



byu must have felt that independence was awesome andn that they would only go if they got this stuff from the big12.



hence, we are not in the big 12 but independent. we overplayed our hand or we simply didn't care to get in the big12 that much.



I personally don't see how byu can make demands like this. If this article is true, byu swung and missed. i guess that is assuming they wanted in which i thought was a fair assumption given we have been waiting for decades to get into a big boy conference. we finally get chance and all the sudden we are in a place to be making notre dame like demands.



oh well. life goes on. i would assume discussion are ongoing regarding 2014.



my guess is that byu is mute because a final decision has not been made.