CougarCorner

Re: Dave Rose

2019-03-25T14:59:11-06:00

Observation 1: BYU's post-season problem is not getting a better seed in the NCAA.

Observation 2: BYU's post-season problem is that they lose to crap teams in the regular season, never win the conference tournament, and don't get into the NCAA tournament at all.

Holmoe's error is that he adjusted BYU's schedule to help them get better NCAA seeding at a time when BYU wasn't even getting to the tournament. He put the cart before the horse and effectively scheduled BYU out of the post-season all together.

Exactly. Tough road wins dont get you in to the tourney, being second overall in a strong league does that. Tough road wins and playing a schedule like BYU is shooting for a 8 or 9 seed.

Statistics: Posted by Brayden Green — Mon Mar 25, 2019 2:59 pm

Re: Dave Rose

2019-03-22T12:19:05-06:00

Observation 1: BYU's post-season problem is not getting a better seed in the NCAA.

Observation 2: BYU's post-season problem is that they lose to crap teams in the regular season, never win the conference tournament, and don't get into the NCAA tournament at all.

Holmoe's error is that he adjusted BYU's schedule to help them get better NCAA seeding at a time when BYU wasn't even getting to the tournament. He put the cart before the horse and effectively scheduled BYU out of the post-season all together.

I think that he adjusted their schedule to help the team to have a shot at an at-large selection - which is very wise when the best team in the conference is named Gonzaga. BYU ended the season tied for second in the conference. And if they took care of business by beating the teams that they should have, they would have had a legitimate argument to be selected as an at large team. Since joining the WCC BYU has never had a problem with seeding in the tournament - when they've gotten in they've gotten the seed that they've deserved. For whatever reason, BYU was traditionally under-seeded as a member of the MWC.

This was a good schedule for a team that was chasing the potential number one team in the nation for the auto bid from their conference. The smart way to hedge your bet on getting into the NCAA tournament was to play a schedule with an eye on a potential at large bid.

NC State was 22-11 and they're in the NIT. Colorado was 21-12 Also in the NIT. There are 3 teams with at least 24 wins in the NIT. I am not even a little persuaded that the basketball schedule was adjusted to get BYU a better seed. I do believe that it was adjusted to get a legitimate shot of an at large selection. Unfortunately, the team blew it and they got exactly what they deserved this year.

Statistics: Posted by ABYUFAN — Fri Mar 22, 2019 12:19 pm

Re: Dave Rose

2019-03-22T12:00:02-06:00

Observation 1: BYU's post-season problem is not getting a better seed in the NCAA.

Observation 2: BYU's post-season problem is that they lose to crap teams in the regular season, never win the conference tournament, and don't get into the NCAA tournament at all.

Holmoe's error is that he adjusted BYU's schedule to help them get better NCAA seeding at a time when BYU wasn't even getting to the tournament. He put the cart before the horse and effectively scheduled BYU out of the post-season all together.

Statistics: Posted by snoscythe — Fri Mar 22, 2019 12:00 pm

Re: Dave Rose

2019-03-22T11:16:04-06:00

Every game on our schedule was winnable except for Nevada and Gonzaga.

We lost to Weber State. We squandered a 14 point lead at home against USF (that would have secured 2nd place in the WCC). We lost to UNLV on a desperation shot. We got blown out by SD. Blown out!

It was a very winnable schedule.

And, I will go on record as saying had we had Bryant, we'd be dancing right now. All season, all we had were two consistent scorers, Haws and Childs. We needed that third threat. Hardnett, wasn't a threat. Cannon, they left him open. Emery, non-threat. Seljaas, nope. Only towards the end when Baxter emerged did opponents have to start worrying about three scorers.

This team definitely was less talented than last year. And if Childs leaves, next year will be the same.

Statistics: Posted by Gunk — Fri Mar 22, 2019 11:16 am

Re: Dave Rose

2019-03-22T09:14:48-06:00

BYU is pretty much infamous for scheduling 1 and 1's or 2 for 1's and BYU getting cancelled on the return.

We're talking basketball. Name one time that that has happened

Byu had more talent this year than last, but we scheduled a lot harder, and we were still young.

I disagree on both of these counts. BYU lost Elijah Bryant. There were no Elijah Bryants coming in to the program replacing him. I would not call BYU more talented this year. And BYU is not a "young team" this year. Look at the junior class - they make a great starting 5. Childs, Hardnett, Haws, Nixon and Seljaas. Throw in Wizard Emery off the bench and you've got 6 of their best 10 players as juniors. This was the year for the Cougars to make some noise, and for whatever reason they didn't.

BYU's road games were much much harder this year, and mediocre/young teams win at home and lose on the road.

If BYU beats Houston at home and USF at home and Weber State and Illinois State on the road then they're looking at 23 wins. It wasn't the schedule that caused the team to have a disjointing year. It was a combination of ineffective coaching and disinterested players. And that needs to be addressed this offseason. Getting rid of things and people who weren't the problem only distracts from being able to correct the actual problem.

Statistics: Posted by ABYUFAN — Fri Mar 22, 2019 9:14 am

Re: Dave Rose

2019-03-21T18:57:50-06:00

BYU needs to follow Utah St example and not leave home except for patsies.
Utah State played n Provo this year

And we beat them. Case in point.

Statistics: Posted by Brayden Green — Thu Mar 21, 2019 6:57 pm

Re: Dave Rose

2019-03-21T18:56:57-06:00

Playing UNLV at Thomas and Mack and UNM at The Pit? SDSU at home and Mississippi State at home? All within 2 weeks of each other? Those are all guaranteed losses. BYU didn't need to schedule up this year, they needed to beat GU and USM both once, Utah State and Utah, and finish second in conference. That's a tourney invite, right there.
We'll just have to disagree on this. UNLV was far far far from a guaranteed loss. It was by 2 points in overtime against a team that hit a last second three pointer to win. It is the very definition of anyone's game. SDSU was not a guaranteed loss either. SDSU lost to University of San Diego at home, and to Fresno State and Brown. Honestly if SDSU is a "guaranteed loss" then BYU has no business being in a post season tournament anyway. Also, SDSU and BYU agreed to a series. SDSU comes to Provo this coming year. That's how series start. Someone has to go on the road first. Also BYU didn't play in the Pitt this year, at least not within two weeks of Mississippi stae. BYU's problems started with the powerhouses of Houston IN PROVO And then might Illinois state, and then giant killer Weber State.

In short this was a schedule that if BYU could have played to what it was capable of, could have earned a shot at an at-large bid. But BYU is afraid of a two game series with San Diego State, then one really has to wonder why even have a basketball program?

It isnt about being afraid, it is about scheduling smart.

BYU is pretty much infamous for scheduling 1 and 1's or 2 for 1's and BYU getting cancelled on the return. Byu had more talent this year than last, but we scheduled a lot harder, and we were still young.

BYU's road games were much much harder this year, and mediocre/young teams win at home and lose on the road.

Statistics: Posted by Brayden Green — Thu Mar 21, 2019 6:56 pm

Re: Dave Rose

2019-03-21T18:00:57-06:00

BYU needs to follow Utah St example and not leave home except for patsies.

Utah State played n Provo this year

Statistics: Posted by ABYUFAN — Thu Mar 21, 2019 6:00 pm

Re: Dave Rose

2019-03-21T17:59:39-06:00

Playing UNLV at Thomas and Mack and UNM at The Pit? SDSU at home and Mississippi State at home? All within 2 weeks of each other? Those are all guaranteed losses. BYU didn't need to schedule up this year, they needed to beat GU and USM both once, Utah State and Utah, and finish second in conference. That's a tourney invite, right there.

We'll just have to disagree on this. UNLV was far far far from a guaranteed loss. It was by 2 points in overtime against a team that hit a last second three pointer to win. It is the very definition of anyone's game. SDSU was not a guaranteed loss either. SDSU lost to University of San Diego at home, and to Fresno State and Brown. Honestly if SDSU is a "guaranteed loss" then BYU has no business being in a post season tournament anyway. Also, SDSU and BYU agreed to a series. SDSU comes to Provo this coming year. That's how series start. Someone has to go on the road first. Also BYU didn't play in the Pitt this year, at least not within two weeks of Mississippi stae. BYU's problems started with the powerhouses of Houston IN PROVO And then might Illinois state, and then giant killer Weber State.

In short this was a schedule that if BYU could have played to what it was capable of, could have earned a shot at an at-large bid. But BYU is afraid of a two game series with San Diego State, then one really has to wonder why even have a basketball program?

Statistics: Posted by ABYUFAN — Thu Mar 21, 2019 5:59 pm

Re: Dave Rose

2019-03-21T17:01:20-06:00

I think Holmoe needs to go, our scheduling has been horrible in basketball the last 5 years, and in my opinion the nail in the coffin was that 4 week roadtrip midseason where we lost a TON of games and played quality teams on the road at their impossibly hard to win at gyms. That was a make it or break it strategy, and it broke the Cougars. They were playing good basketball before then, and they eventually played good basketball down the stretch, but I think that stretch of losses was transformative for the program and I dont see many people holding Holmoes get to the fire.
BYU's entire athletic department is currently ranked at number 3 I believe, and you want to fire the athletic director who is in charge of the entire athletic department because the basketball team scheduled games that could allow them to earn an at-large NCAA bid? That is just crazy talk. BYU's entire athletic department as a whole has literally never been this good, so your reaction to that is to get rid of the guy who oversaw that...

And it's not like the basketball team had a murderers row during that stretch either UNLV won 17 games this year and SDSU won 21. Mississippi State was a very tough game but schools are generally rewarded for scheduling tough games. Of all of the people responsible for this fiasco Holmoe is not very high on the list.
+1

BYU could have gotten into at least the NIT tournament with 5 more wins instead of losses.

Playing UNLV at Thomas and Mack and UNM at The Pit? SDSU at home and Mississippi State at home? All within 2 weeks of each other? Those are all guaranteed losses. BYU didn't need to schedule up this year, they needed to beat GU and USM both once, Utah State and Utah, and finish second in conference. That's a tourney invite, right there.

Both will likely stay, and that's fine, but Holmoe is as much to blame for this season as Rose. BYU needs to follow Utah St example and not leave home except for patsies.

Statistics: Posted by Brayden Green — Thu Mar 21, 2019 5:01 pm