BYU - Utah Game Thread

[frdbtr]

Wrong all the way around. Reynolds was the Oline coach in 00 but was moved to the RB coach in 04 when Grimes has hired. Grimes was not "let go" he left to become the assistant head coach and Oline coach for a different university (a promotion). Roger French was the Oline coach, he was also co Ocoordinator with Norm Chow dude. You seriously have no clue what you are talking about. Please stop posting stuff you know nothing about.

2000 was Lavell's last season as HC. 2001 to 2004 was the Crowton era when Reynolds was the o-line coach and Bronco era began in 2005 which is what I said just not in these words. Reynolds was moved to the RB coach in Broncos first year as HC which was 2005 and BYUs run game suffered because of it. Grimes leaving to go to another school doesn't matter as the 2 years he was O-line coach BYU still had O-line problems. the fact he became a good O-line coach is a testament to the coaches at the other schools he worked with. Roger French was the Co-OC with Norm Chow after the previous OC left to take another job after 1984 national championship. He may have been the O-line coach as well, but he was always listed as the Co-OC but was never listed as the O-line coach. In any case the o-line under Lavell was the best O-line BYU has ever had and the O-line fell apart when Crowton was HC and has never been the same since.

So, let me think, Grimes was hired in 04, the Oline was a complete mess. He left after the 07 season after BYU had beaten TCU twice with solid Oline play. First off, that is 4 years, not 2 and the Oline was solid from 05 until he left. TCU just happens to have a pretty good Defense and they pummelled Max Hall in 08 and 09 when we played them. Second of all, if you go to cougarstats.com and look at the coaching through the years, Roger French is listed as the Oline coach the whole time Lavell was the coach so I have no idea what you are talking about when you say "he may have been the Oline coach but was never listed as the Oline coach". Seriously dude.

Actually BYU first game against TCU was the one BYU lost in OT thanks to a bum call when the TCU player was out of bounds. BYU beat them the next 2 years because TCU wasn't very good then TCU blew BYU out due to poor coaching decisions by Bronco which led to TCU developing the killer D they had in 08 until 2011 when TCU only won from bad coaching decisions by Bronco again as TCU was in a down year that year from losing their star QB. After which TCU has become really good again. It isn't hard to understand as Roger French was never listed as the O-line coach just go BYUcougars.com which is he official BYU athletic web site and you will see that he was listed as the Co-OC. Seriously dude we have be saying the same thing just in the same words.

You are wrong about all of this. TCU was ranked in the top 20 in 06 when BYU went down there and beat them in their own house. I never said anything about the 05 loss.

No you didn't per say but you did say BYU beat TCU in their first game with Grimes which was 2005. TCU was ranked in the top 20 but was no top 20 team as they had 3 or 4 MWC losses that year and in 2007 BYU pounded them again, but your right 2008 through 2010 TCU was very good defensively and offensively and had a star QB who started the 2007 season as the 3rd string QB but became their starter as the other QBs got injured. When TCU's Star QB left at the end of the 2010 season as well as some of the star defenders which caused TCU to be weak in 2011.

No I didn't. I specified 06 and 07 every time I mentioned it. As far as 3-4 MWC losses in 06, that would be really hard since they went 11-2 that year.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2006_TCU_ ... tball_team

[Ddawg]

Reality check, when BYU loses 7 straight, and has not beaten the UofU since 2009, well, officially BYU is the little brother.

As I have posted before, BYU is not an elite football program. BYU is a good program with "out-sized" ambitions. We can have elite players from time to time. We even have very good teams that out-perform from time to time. Occasionally we get elite players (Taysom Hill and Jamaal Williams are elite).

Overall, we are a good team that cannot hang with elite teams and very good teams regularly. Utah is a very good team and has a very good program. I tip my hat to the Utah players and the program Kyle Whittingham has built. It is formidable.

[BoiseBYU]

Just got home from the game. Here's the ugly truth my friends.

The offense is a total shambles. There's only one guy on offense who is any good, Matt Bushman. Tanner Mangum is a mess. He's making wrong reads, he's underthrowing 95% of his passes. He's locked on to receivers making for easy picks. He's completely unaware of his blindside. He had one good drive where he looked like the Mangum of old. It's probably enough to give him the start again next week, but only barely.

The offensive line is a mess. They aren't recognizing when potential pass rushers will have a free lane to the QB. They are barely getting any surge or holes open on run blocks. Their bright side is that they didn't have any personal fouls called against them that I recall.

The running backs are terrible. They aren't picking up pass protections, they aren't making a guy miss, they aren't falling forward when hit.

The receivers are awful. They aren't making the easy catches, let alone the tough catches. They struggle to get open, they are making mental mistakes like getting offensive PI when it was completely unnecessary.

The defense isn't as good as we're giving them credit for. Yes, they stiffen up inside the 20, but they are giving up far too many long drives and huge chunk yardage plays.

Special teams is also poor. Missed field goals, onsides kicks that go out of bounds, just a disaster.

Coaches are clueless. They don't have any idea at all how to fix the issues. The schemes are just bad. The play calling is bad. Players are starting to grumble and divisions are forming in the locker room from some of the whispers I'm hearing from people in the know.

Other than that, things are looking up, yes? TIC

[mtnradio]

OK ... this is a very pessimistic thread. I can't blame anybody for that, I"m pessimistic today too. I've had high hopes for Sitake/Detmer/et al, I've had high hopes for this team. It will be a LONG season, BYU may not qualify for a bowl this year, the team is going to fracture (and the real test of Sitake will be whether he can pull them together again) and the extra bad news is that it is going to get worse next week. Utah doesn't compare to Wiscy .... it will be ugly next week.

Bright spots from last night:
1) Time of possession was closer (32:27 - 27:33)
2) More than 200 yds of offense ... more than doubled the output from LSU
3) twice as effective on 3rd downs as Utah (6/15 - 3/14)
(stat source: http://www.espn.com/college-football/ma ... =400935263)
4) Penalties ... few
5) Red zone defense was still pretty good
6) Fonua and Tolutau

[BroncoBot]

Just got home from the game. Here's the ugly truth my friends.

The offense is a total shambles. There's only one guy on offense who is any good, Matt Bushman. Tanner Mangum is a mess. He's making wrong reads, he's underthrowing 95% of his passes. He's locked on to receivers making for easy picks. He's completely unaware of his blindside. He had one good drive where he looked like the Mangum of old. It's probably enough to give him the start again next week, but only barely.

The offensive line is a mess. They aren't recognizing when potential pass rushers will have a free lane to the QB. They are barely getting any surge or holes open on run blocks. Their bright side is that they didn't have any personal fouls called against them that I recall.

The running backs are terrible. They aren't picking up pass protections, they aren't making a guy miss, they aren't falling forward when hit.

The receivers are awful. They aren't making the easy catches, let alone the tough catches. They struggle to get open, they are making mental mistakes like getting offensive PI when it was completely unnecessary.

The defense isn't as good as we're giving them credit for. Yes, they stiffen up inside the 20, but they are giving up far too many long drives and huge chunk yardage plays.

Special teams is also poor. Missed field goals, onsides kicks that go out of bounds, just a disaster.

Coaches are clueless. They don't have any idea at all how to fix the issues. The schemes are just bad. The play calling is bad. Players are starting to grumble and divisions are forming in the locker room from some of the whispers I'm hearing from people in the know.

Other than that, things are looking up, yes? TIC

Silver lining. Last 2 weeks were against stout teams. Generally BYU doesn't look great against those types. Heck, BYU had a shot at a game winning drive last night despite all of the negatives that hawk points out.

The not silver lining - BYU plays several more of these types of teams.

[hawkwing]

Just got home from the game. Here's the ugly truth my friends.

The offense is a total shambles. There's only one guy on offense who is any good, Matt Bushman. Tanner Mangum is a mess. He's making wrong reads, he's underthrowing 95% of his passes. He's locked on to receivers making for easy picks. He's completely unaware of his blindside. He had one good drive where he looked like the Mangum of old. It's probably enough to give him the start again next week, but only barely.

The offensive line is a mess. They aren't recognizing when potential pass rushers will have a free lane to the QB. They are barely getting any surge or holes open on run blocks. Their bright side is that they didn't have any personal fouls called against them that I recall.

The running backs are terrible. They aren't picking up pass protections, they aren't making a guy miss, they aren't falling forward when hit.

The receivers are awful. They aren't making the easy catches, let alone the tough catches. They struggle to get open, they are making mental mistakes like getting offensive PI when it was completely unnecessary.

The defense isn't as good as we're giving them credit for. Yes, they stiffen up inside the 20, but they are giving up far too many long drives and huge chunk yardage plays.

Special teams is also poor. Missed field goals, onsides kicks that go out of bounds, just a disaster.

Coaches are clueless. They don't have any idea at all how to fix the issues. The schemes are just bad. The play calling is bad. Players are starting to grumble and divisions are forming in the locker room from some of the whispers I'm hearing from people in the know.

Other than that, things are looking up, yes? TIC

Silver lining. Last 2 weeks were against stout teams. Generally BYU doesn't look great against those types. Heck, BYU had a shot at a game winning drive last night despite all of the negatives that hawk points out.

The not silver lining - BYU plays several more of these types of teams.

The dark side of that silver lining is that this is the least stout Utah's defense has been in probably 10 years, and LSU gave up 10 points to an FCS team.

[TulaneVandyRiceCoug]

The internal divisiveness will hurt this team more if unchecked. I rarely have an insider perspective, but I did hear a receiver complaining after the game to a group of girls why Tanner wasn't throwing him the ball more often.

Waaaaaa!!! You poor thing! Probably because (a) he was running for his life too often, and (b) you really weren't open that much

[Gunk]

The internal divisiveness will hurt this team more if unchecked. I rarely have an insider perspective, but I did hear a receiver complaining after the game to a group of girls why Tanner wasn't throwing him the ball more often.

Waaaaaa!!! You poor thing! Probably because (a) he was running for his life too often, and (b) you really weren't open that much

Yeah, if only Tanner had thrown him the ball. He would have won the Holy War and then probably gone to the NFL.

[Mars]

Dean, just give up, you've been way off base all thread.

Steve Clark is our current TE coach. Bushman is a great receiver, but can he block? Who is our 2nd-string TE?

Grimes was our last great OL coach, before going on to coach at multiple SEC schools. Roger French may be our best OL coach of all time.

OL is really bad. Tejan is a decent center, now that his chop blocks are under control, but the rest can't pick up a blitz to save Tanner's life.

Tanner looks bad. Just like Tasysom did last year. They both looked great before Detmer. I think they expect the worst from their oline every play, and end up rushing every throw as a result. No reason to think Hoge could even be this good.

WRs look awful. How many chances can Hifo get? Meanwhile, Micah Simon was by far our best WR against LSU and was benched this week. Trinnaman is our fastest WR and was benched this week. Beau Tanner sat this week after giving up on an INT last week.

RBs seem to have no depth chart. Ula looks like our best back, but was given 5 touches, including none in the 1st, 2nd, and 4th quarters. Squally, Fonua, Dye, and Burt seem to play or not play at random. Dye seems to be our worst player at RB, but played the most this game. He has the makings of a good slot receiver though (as seen on his touchdown play). Burt got moved to D for unknown reasons. I did like the jet sweeps and shovel pass this week. Still far too many runs up the gut behind an atrocious run-blocking oline though. Including that run on 3rd-and-15ish. Ugh.

This week against Wisconsin will be ugly. Detmer, Cahoon, and Mahe have a lot to prove. Still, the worst case scenario for this season may be 7-6. We play some terrible teams later on.

[snoscythe]

Ula looks like our best back, but was given 5 touches, including none in the 1st, 2nd, and 4th quarters.

From what I understand, everyone on the staff knows Ula will be the guy, but he doesn't have his legs back under him yet. The hope was that Squally and Burt could shoulder the load this season and Ula could redshirt to get his stamina up, but that plan fell apart in August when it became apparent that wasn't going to work, so now they are left having to try to bring Ula along during the season, but having to limit him to 10-15 reps (reps, not even carries) a game so they don't run him into a wall. You can see he's gassed after two or three carries.

It's a statement of (1) how bad the rest of the RB field is, and (2) how much better Ula is than the rest of the herd.