BYU - Utah Game Thread

[frdbtr]

Tanner played pretty poorly this game.

Just like he did last time he played them. All y'all were saying Tanner has "it". We are now seeing what happens when your LUCK runs out and you're not lobbing last second TDs to win games.

And I'm not blaming Tanner. Offense is in shambles. I disagree with anyone who said Tanner had time tonight. Huntley's line performed awesome. I don't think we recorded a single sack. Who are the running backs? Have we decided to just abandon the run game? Receiver did NOT fight through a single thing. Only one I'm impressed with was Bushman.

This is how I saw it too. Tanner is rushing his reads because he has no time to throw and he knows it. The Oline needs to give him more time. He wasn't lucky in 15. That offense was more simple and the Oline blocked better, plus the receiver play, while still not as tough as it was in the 90's was way better than what we have this year.

[TheDean]

Tanner really wouldn't be fine, I appreciate how well loved he is to many of you from his 3 big hail mary passes. But it's disingenuous to say he's anything but an F graded QB this year. Even when he has time he's locked on to receivers, under throwing balls, and making bad calls. Part of that is this offense is so terrible only the best of the best QBs can make it look like it's even slightly viable, but in an Anae offense Mangum would probably look fairly decent, but he'd still have some serious flaws.

The offense is terrible because Tanner is running for his life on virtually every play because the O-line is so porous and it doesn't help when the WRs drop balls that were right in the hands like the last 2 that Tanner threw which would have given BYU a first down had they not been dropped. The RBs can't run effectively because the o-line can't run block any better than they pass block which is not at all. When tanner had time to throw he was just fine as was shown in BYU's last scoring drive of the game. They need to start big #5 as the RB because when he hit someone they fell over and he was able to get extra yards.

[hawkwing]

Tanner really wouldn't be fine, I appreciate how well loved he is to many of you from his 3 big hail mary passes. But it's disingenuous to say he's anything but an F graded QB this year. Even when he has time he's locked on to receivers, under throwing balls, and making bad calls. Part of that is this offense is so terrible only the best of the best QBs can make it look like it's even slightly viable, but in an Anae offense Mangum would probably look fairly decent, but he'd still have some serious flaws.

The offense is terrible because Tanner is running for his life on virtually every play because the O-line is so porous and it doesn't help when the WRs drop balls that were right in the hands like the last 2 that Tanner threw which would have given BYU a first down had they not been dropped. The RBs can't run effectively because the o-line can't run block any better than they pass block which is not at all. When tanner had time to throw he was just fine as was shown in BYU's last scoring drive of the game. They need to start big #5 as the RB because when he hit someone they fell over and he was able to get extra yards.

Rewatch the first half. Tanner has as much of the blame as anyone else on the field.

[frdbtr]

Tanner really wouldn't be fine, I appreciate how well loved he is to many of you from his 3 big hail mary passes. But it's disingenuous to say he's anything but an F graded QB this year. Even when he has time he's locked on to receivers, under throwing balls, and making bad calls. Part of that is this offense is so terrible only the best of the best QBs can make it look like it's even slightly viable, but in an Anae offense Mangum would probably look fairly decent, but he'd still have some serious flaws.

The offense is terrible because Tanner is running for his life on virtually every play because the O-line is so porous and it doesn't help when the WRs drop balls that were right in the hands like the last 2 that Tanner threw which would have given BYU a first down had they not been dropped. The RBs can't run effectively because the o-line can't run block any better than they pass block which is not at all. When tanner had time to throw he was just fine as was shown in BYU's last scoring drive of the game. They need to start big #5 as the RB because when he hit someone they fell over and he was able to get extra yards.

Rewatch the first half. Tanner has as much of the blame as anyone else on the field.

This is what everyone was saying about Taysom Hill last year. Sometimes it isn't the QB folks. Sometimes it is his "playmakers" who surround him.

[hawkwing]

Tanner really wouldn't be fine, I appreciate how well loved he is to many of you from his 3 big hail mary passes. But it's disingenuous to say he's anything but an F graded QB this year. Even when he has time he's locked on to receivers, under throwing balls, and making bad calls. Part of that is this offense is so terrible only the best of the best QBs can make it look like it's even slightly viable, but in an Anae offense Mangum would probably look fairly decent, but he'd still have some serious flaws.

The offense is terrible because Tanner is running for his life on virtually every play because the O-line is so porous and it doesn't help when the WRs drop balls that were right in the hands like the last 2 that Tanner threw which would have given BYU a first down had they not been dropped. The RBs can't run effectively because the o-line can't run block any better than they pass block which is not at all. When tanner had time to throw he was just fine as was shown in BYU's last scoring drive of the game. They need to start big #5 as the RB because when he hit someone they fell over and he was able to get extra yards.

Rewatch the first half. Tanner has as much of the blame as anyone else on the field.

This is what everyone was saying about Taysom Hill last year. Sometimes it isn't the QB folks. Sometimes it is his "playmakers" who surround him.

Not me, I always recognized that Taysom was one of the best QBs BYU had ever had who was hampered by a very bad system and struggled with a lack of play makers around him.

Tanner is no where near as good as Taysom is, but he does also have to deal with having a bad system. It just makes him look that much worse because he's not as gifted at running or throwing as Taysom is.

[TheDean]

Really as I recall Beck was still be chased most of the time in 06 as the o-line was the worst it had ever been thanks to coach Reynolds and has never really improved and if he was so good then why wasn't he kept as O-line coach after the season was over. In Lavell's last year BYU had 3 outland trophy winners on the o-line, who played the next year under Reynolds in Crowtons first season as HC and the O-line steadily went down hill as the season went on and has never been the same since and BYU has made 5 or 6 changes in O-line coaches since Lavell left.

Reynolds wasn't the oline coach in 06, he was the RB's coach. Jeff Grimes was hired in 04 to be the Oline coach and stayed until 07. BYU beat TCU in 06 and 07. John Beck had to badly sprained ankles against TCU and could barely walk but still was able to stand behind his Oline and pick the TCU defense apart. Grimes left after the 07 season and in 08 TCU pummeled Max Hall. BYU's offensive line was still decent in 08 and 08 but in 10 they got worse and it just kept going from there. I agree that Roger French was probably BYU's best Oline coach of all time but Grimes was a very good one. He is, incidentally, LSU's offensive line coach and their line is pretty good as we saw last week.

I agree that LSU's O-line was pretty good but if Grimes was so good why did BYU let him go after 2 seasons??? Reynolds was the O-line coach from the time Lavell left until Bronco took over and as 06 was under Bronco so your are right there. Roger French was the Co-OC and not the O-lime coach. I believe Ramage was the O-line coach under Lavell, but who ever it was had several Outland trophy winners over Lavells time as HC.

Wrong all the way around. Reynolds was the Oline coach in 00 but was moved to the RB coach in 04 when Grimes has hired. Grimes was not "let go" he left to become the assistant head coach and Oline coach for a different university (a promotion). Roger French was the Oline coach, he was also co Ocoordinator with Norm Chow dude. You seriously have no clue what you are talking about. Please stop posting stuff you know nothing about.

2000 was Lavell's last season as HC. 2001 to 2004 was the Crowton era when Reynolds was the o-line coach and Bronco era began in 2005 which is what I said just not in these words. Reynolds was moved to the RB coach in Broncos first year as HC which was 2005 and BYUs run game suffered because of it. Grimes leaving to go to another school doesn't matter as the 2 years he was O-line coach BYU still had O-line problems. the fact he became a good O-line coach is a testament to the coaches at the other schools he worked with. Roger French was the Co-OC with Norm Chow after the previous OC left to take another job after 1984 national championship. He may have been the O-line coach as well, but he was always listed as the Co-OC but was never listed as the O-line coach. In any case the o-line under Lavell was the best O-line BYU has ever had and the O-line fell apart when Crowton was HC and has never been the same since.

So, let me think, Grimes was hired in 04, the Oline was a complete mess. He left after the 07 season after BYU had beaten TCU twice with solid Oline play. First off, that is 4 years, not 2 and the Oline was solid from 05 until he left. TCU just happens to have a pretty good Defense and they pummelled Max Hall in 08 and 09 when we played them. Second of all, if you go to cougarstats.com and look at the coaching through the years, Roger French is listed as the Oline coach the whole time Lavell was the coach so I have no idea what you are talking about when you say "he may have been the Oline coach but was never listed as the Oline coach". Seriously dude.

Actually BYU first game against TCU was the one BYU lost in OT thanks to a bum call when the TCU player was out of bounds. BYU beat them the next 2 years because TCU wasn't very good then TCU blew BYU out due to poor coaching decisions by Bronco which led to TCU developing the killer D they had in 08 until 2011 when TCU only won from bad coaching decisions by Bronco again as TCU was in a down year that year from losing their star QB. After which TCU has become really good again. It isn't hard to understand as Roger French was never listed as the O-line coach just go BYUcougars.com which is he official BYU athletic web site and you will see that he was listed as the Co-OC. Seriously dude we have be saying the same thing just in the same words.

[frdbtr]

I don't know what the exact answer is but I do know that Tanner Mangum is a very talented Thrower, we saw it in 15. Did he lose his talent? Why are his throws so far off all of a sudden? I am blaming the Oline and receivers. They were bad last year and have not improved. Kalani is vowing major changes. I don't know what changes could be made short of replacing some offensive coaches and trying to get better play from the players with better coaching. Something has to be done. BYU has the talent, it is not being utilized correctly.

[frdbtr]

Reynolds wasn't the oline coach in 06, he was the RB's coach. Jeff Grimes was hired in 04 to be the Oline coach and stayed until 07. BYU beat TCU in 06 and 07. John Beck had to badly sprained ankles against TCU and could barely walk but still was able to stand behind his Oline and pick the TCU defense apart. Grimes left after the 07 season and in 08 TCU pummeled Max Hall. BYU's offensive line was still decent in 08 and 08 but in 10 they got worse and it just kept going from there. I agree that Roger French was probably BYU's best Oline coach of all time but Grimes was a very good one. He is, incidentally, LSU's offensive line coach and their line is pretty good as we saw last week.

I agree that LSU's O-line was pretty good but if Grimes was so good why did BYU let him go after 2 seasons??? Reynolds was the O-line coach from the time Lavell left until Bronco took over and as 06 was under Bronco so your are right there. Roger French was the Co-OC and not the O-lime coach. I believe Ramage was the O-line coach under Lavell, but who ever it was had several Outland trophy winners over Lavells time as HC.

Wrong all the way around. Reynolds was the Oline coach in 00 but was moved to the RB coach in 04 when Grimes has hired. Grimes was not "let go" he left to become the assistant head coach and Oline coach for a different university (a promotion). Roger French was the Oline coach, he was also co Ocoordinator with Norm Chow dude. You seriously have no clue what you are talking about. Please stop posting stuff you know nothing about.

2000 was Lavell's last season as HC. 2001 to 2004 was the Crowton era when Reynolds was the o-line coach and Bronco era began in 2005 which is what I said just not in these words. Reynolds was moved to the RB coach in Broncos first year as HC which was 2005 and BYUs run game suffered because of it. Grimes leaving to go to another school doesn't matter as the 2 years he was O-line coach BYU still had O-line problems. the fact he became a good O-line coach is a testament to the coaches at the other schools he worked with. Roger French was the Co-OC with Norm Chow after the previous OC left to take another job after 1984 national championship. He may have been the O-line coach as well, but he was always listed as the Co-OC but was never listed as the O-line coach. In any case the o-line under Lavell was the best O-line BYU has ever had and the O-line fell apart when Crowton was HC and has never been the same since.

So, let me think, Grimes was hired in 04, the Oline was a complete mess. He left after the 07 season after BYU had beaten TCU twice with solid Oline play. First off, that is 4 years, not 2 and the Oline was solid from 05 until he left. TCU just happens to have a pretty good Defense and they pummelled Max Hall in 08 and 09 when we played them. Second of all, if you go to cougarstats.com and look at the coaching through the years, Roger French is listed as the Oline coach the whole time Lavell was the coach so I have no idea what you are talking about when you say "he may have been the Oline coach but was never listed as the Oline coach". Seriously dude.

Actually BYU first game against TCU was the one BYU lost in OT thanks to a bum call when the TCU player was out of bounds. BYU beat them the next 2 years because TCU wasn't very good then TCU blew BYU out due to poor coaching decisions by Bronco which led to TCU developing the killer D they had in 08 until 2011 when TCU only won from bad coaching decisions by Bronco again as TCU was in a down year that year from losing their star QB. After which TCU has become really good again. It isn't hard to understand as Roger French was never listed as the O-line coach just go BYUcougars.com which is he official BYU athletic web site and you will see that he was listed as the Co-OC. Seriously dude we have be saying the same thing just in the same words.

You are wrong about all of this. TCU was ranked in the top 20 in 06 when BYU went down there and beat them in their own house. I never said anything about the 05 loss.

[TheDean]

Tanner really wouldn't be fine, I appreciate how well loved he is to many of you from his 3 big hail mary passes. But it's disingenuous to say he's anything but an F graded QB this year. Even when he has time he's locked on to receivers, under throwing balls, and making bad calls. Part of that is this offense is so terrible only the best of the best QBs can make it look like it's even slightly viable, but in an Anae offense Mangum would probably look fairly decent, but he'd still have some serious flaws.

The offense is terrible because Tanner is running for his life on virtually every play because the O-line is so porous and it doesn't help when the WRs drop balls that were right in the hands like the last 2 that Tanner threw which would have given BYU a first down had they not been dropped. The RBs can't run effectively because the o-line can't run block any better than they pass block which is not at all. When tanner had time to throw he was just fine as was shown in BYU's last scoring drive of the game. They need to start big #5 as the RB because when he hit someone they fell over and he was able to get extra yards.

Rewatch the first half. Tanner has as much of the blame as anyone else on the field.

This is what everyone was saying about Taysom Hill last year. Sometimes it isn't the QB folks. Sometimes it is his "playmakers" who surround him.

Not me, I always recognized that Taysom was one of the best QBs BYU had ever had who was hampered by a very bad system and struggled with a lack of play makers around him.

Tanner is no where near as good as Taysom is, but he does also have to deal with having a bad system. It just makes him look that much worse because he's not as gifted at running or throwing as Taysom is.

Exactly my point hawkwing. Give Tanner a solid O-line that can give him time to survey the field and throw the ball and decent WRs that can hold on to the ball and can get open Tanner would be one of BYU's top QBs. Funny how under Doman, Cahoon's WRs could hold on to the ball or get open with two different QBs and now under Ty, Cahoon's WRs still are dropping the ball and failing to get open with two different QBs. It seems to me the QBs aren't the problem but the WRs. Incidentally the o-line was just as bad under Doman when the WRs were dropping the ball as it is now.

[TheDean]

I agree that LSU's O-line was pretty good but if Grimes was so good why did BYU let him go after 2 seasons??? Reynolds was the O-line coach from the time Lavell left until Bronco took over and as 06 was under Bronco so your are right there. Roger French was the Co-OC and not the O-lime coach. I believe Ramage was the O-line coach under Lavell, but who ever it was had several Outland trophy winners over Lavells time as HC.

Wrong all the way around. Reynolds was the Oline coach in 00 but was moved to the RB coach in 04 when Grimes has hired. Grimes was not "let go" he left to become the assistant head coach and Oline coach for a different university (a promotion). Roger French was the Oline coach, he was also co Ocoordinator with Norm Chow dude. You seriously have no clue what you are talking about. Please stop posting stuff you know nothing about.

2000 was Lavell's last season as HC. 2001 to 2004 was the Crowton era when Reynolds was the o-line coach and Bronco era began in 2005 which is what I said just not in these words. Reynolds was moved to the RB coach in Broncos first year as HC which was 2005 and BYUs run game suffered because of it. Grimes leaving to go to another school doesn't matter as the 2 years he was O-line coach BYU still had O-line problems. the fact he became a good O-line coach is a testament to the coaches at the other schools he worked with. Roger French was the Co-OC with Norm Chow after the previous OC left to take another job after 1984 national championship. He may have been the O-line coach as well, but he was always listed as the Co-OC but was never listed as the O-line coach. In any case the o-line under Lavell was the best O-line BYU has ever had and the O-line fell apart when Crowton was HC and has never been the same since.

So, let me think, Grimes was hired in 04, the Oline was a complete mess. He left after the 07 season after BYU had beaten TCU twice with solid Oline play. First off, that is 4 years, not 2 and the Oline was solid from 05 until he left. TCU just happens to have a pretty good Defense and they pummelled Max Hall in 08 and 09 when we played them. Second of all, if you go to cougarstats.com and look at the coaching through the years, Roger French is listed as the Oline coach the whole time Lavell was the coach so I have no idea what you are talking about when you say "he may have been the Oline coach but was never listed as the Oline coach". Seriously dude.

Actually BYU first game against TCU was the one BYU lost in OT thanks to a bum call when the TCU player was out of bounds. BYU beat them the next 2 years because TCU wasn't very good then TCU blew BYU out due to poor coaching decisions by Bronco which led to TCU developing the killer D they had in 08 until 2011 when TCU only won from bad coaching decisions by Bronco again as TCU was in a down year that year from losing their star QB. After which TCU has become really good again. It isn't hard to understand as Roger French was never listed as the O-line coach just go BYUcougars.com which is he official BYU athletic web site and you will see that he was listed as the Co-OC. Seriously dude we have be saying the same thing just in the same words.

You are wrong about all of this. TCU was ranked in the top 20 in 06 when BYU went down there and beat them in their own house. I never said anything about the 05 loss.

No you didn't per say but you did say BYU beat TCU in their first game with Grimes which was 2005. TCU was ranked in the top 20 but was no top 20 team as they had 3 or 4 MWC losses that year and in 2007 BYU pounded them again, but your right 2008 through 2010 TCU was very good defensively and offensively and had a star QB who started the 2007 season as the 3rd string QB but became their starter as the other QBs got injured. When TCU's Star QB left at the end of the 2010 season as well as some of the star defenders which caused TCU to be weak in 2011.